Wild overbet on the river -- 5-10

Rococo · #1 06-23-2005, 05:37 PM

HU NLH 5-10

I have played with Villain a couple of times before. I know him to be a generically bad player (e.g. calls too much with the second best hand, makes dumb bluffs, doesn't pay enough attention to position, etc.), but I have never played him HU. We each have approximately $1K in front.

3rd hand in the session, Villain minraises to $20 preflop on the button. I assume that this raise doesn't mean much HU. I call with 7 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

Flop comes A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. I lead for $25. Villain calls.

Turn is a brick. I check. Villain bets $30. I call.

River is T [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], completing my flush. I figure that Villain will expect me to value bet if I have a flush, so I overbet the pot for $200 and hope that he looks me up with an A or two pair. Instead, he pushes. Call or fold?

phil_ivey_fan · #2 06-23-2005, 05:49 PM

I call.

reasoning...
1) "..makes dumb bluffs..."
2) HU, you are very strong
3) Qx or Jx hearts are the only holdings that beat you.

His 6h-5h no g00t.

9cao · #3 06-23-2005, 06:00 PM

Tough spot. I would say that the only way Villain has flush is if it is Kx hearts (the nuts) since he bet the turn so weakly. A flush draw without a pair would but more or check, and I also think a set would bet to protect. Depends on how bad he is, because he would have to be really bad to do this without the nuts or near-nuts. A set would just call and try to pick off your bluff, and bluffing back at a huge over-bet is very, very risky. I fold.

captZEEbo1 · #4 06-23-2005, 06:51 PM

call...you said villain makes bad bluffs. For all you know, he's trying to represent the flush and doesn't even consider what you are betting with.

kagame · #5 06-23-2005, 06:59 PM

i like these overbets alot more when you go runner runner

that is the point ciaffonne makes. something to the effect of "if youre going to rep something, then rep it damnit!"

but the problem with your hand is he could easily put you on it, it makes sense, and he should fold many big hands here

only reason you can call is because of your read on the other players style and your dynamic together, id call about 70-80% of the time in this spot, randomizing it on a clock or something equally silly

i think calling 100% of the time here even against a player as described could not be +EV, because he will stop bluffing you so hard

Rococo · #6 06-23-2005, 07:19 PM

[ QUOTE ]
id call about 70-80% of the time in this spot, randomizing it on a clock or something equally silly

i think calling 100% of the time here even against a player as described could not be +EV, because he will stop bluffing you so hard

[/ QUOTE ]

Randomizing in this way makes no sense to me. I have no intention of folding face up. Why not fold some other hands where I have even less chance of winning at showdown. That way I get the best of both worlds -- I fold a loser and Villain can believe that he bluffed me off a winner.

mgsimpleton · #7 06-23-2005, 07:21 PM

[ QUOTE ]

i think calling 100% of the time here even against a player as described could not be +EV, because he will stop bluffing you so hard

[/ QUOTE ]

but he's not talking about 100% of the time here... this is the first time this has happened, that hero has overbet and villain has pushed. so it's not about whether he should do it the 2nd or 3rd time, it's about whether he should do it the first time.

i think this is an autocall. he could be making a horrible bluff, he could have a set or two pair and think it's good HU, or he could have a lower flush. i'd have to have a VERY good read to fold the 4th nuts HU, and given that he's a bad player according to you, it'd have to be the sickest read in the world. i'm calling and thinking about all the sex i'm going to buy with my new money. oh... i mean... ack

BobboFitos · #8 06-23-2005, 09:26 PM

[ QUOTE ]
i'm calling and thinking about all the sex i'm going to buy with my new money. oh... i mean... ack

[/ QUOTE ]

arent you a woman? i didnt know women bought sex

mgsimpleton · #9 06-24-2005, 12:05 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i'm calling and thinking about all the sex i'm going to buy with my new money. oh... i mean... ack

[/ QUOTE ]

arent you a woman? i didnt know women bought sex

[/ QUOTE ]

it was hypothetical, putting myself in hero's shoes, empathizing with the OP... come on give me some poetic license here...

BobboFitos · #10 06-24-2005, 12:50 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Poster: fslexcduck

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glad you're back