I haven't "seen monsters" in a while.... until here (QQ 6max hand)

[jhall23]

I totally hate this hand, but at the same time I really felt like I was behind. Even so, I only need to win about 32 % of the time. Villian in this hand was pretty odd. Very lag seeing about 70 percent of flops and raising about 14 percent, however EVERY raise was a min raise. In all the hands we had played I have never seen him make a re-raise pre-flop. He is also aggressive post flop, but has never made a big raise before or put his whole stack in the middle.

Only notable hand we had together, I limped AK utg and he min-raised from the BB. Noticing he raises a good amount I limp-raise to 7. He is the only caller. He weak leads for 3 into a QT8 two diamond flop (15 ish) and I raise to 15 and take it down.

Pre-flop I was kinda hoping short stack (who was bad) would just push in and I would most likely take a quick $20 pot, but villian was pretty loose so I of course want to charge being OOP in case he calls.

His push was relatively quick. I did the whole "I made him pay alot to outflop me thing" in my head and was going to call and but my gut kept telling me I was behind. I was thinking he knows my range here and has no reason to believe I will fold an overpair after the action and really felt he wanted a call. I put him on 44 or AKc. Based on how much he calls pre-flop I wouldn't be suprised if he had a hand with a 3 in it either.

How bad is this?????

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (6 max, 6 handed) converter

saw flop|<font color="#C00000">saw showdown</font>

MP ($18.95)
CO ($212.28)
Button ($66.79)
Hero ($108.3)
BB ($113.6)
UTG ($118.05)

Preflop: Hero is SB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP raises to $2</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Button calls $2, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $9</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP folds, Button calls $7.

Flop: ($21) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $15</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises to $57.79 (All-In)</font>, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $93.79

[kurto]

I don't think its terrible. Though I know a lot of superlags who will push with any flush draw and will bluff on any paired board.

I think the most important thing is you said this play wasn't typical for him.

[RiverFenix]

I think you have more than enough information to fold this if his stack was deeper. However with the small amount coming back to you makes it much tougher...

I usually fold here, am interested to see the arguments for calling though

[Los Feliz Slim]

This is obviously entirely read-based, especially the minraise. Was he minraising with anything, or does the minraise indicate at least a little strength?

I'm not a 6-max player so this could be wrong, but I would tend to give someone who's 70% VP$IP very little credit (how many hands of his had you seen?).

If you DO give him a lot of credit, how much does he know about you? If you've got a low VP$IP and don't raise much pf, he could correctly put you on monsters and push with ATC, knowing you won't call without a 3, which he knows you don't have.

EDIT: This was meant to be the devil's advocate argument for calling but it didn't work out that way. I fold this with no more information. I have had this happen recently at a table where I believed I looked like I could be pushed around based on earlier events. Without something like that do go on it's a good fold.

[jhall23]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think its terrible. Though I know a lot of superlags who will push with any flush draw and will bluff on any paired board.

I think the most important thing is you said this play wasn't typical for him.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes the fact that I hadn't seen him go crazy post flop was what had my spidey sense going. There are definetly many an opponent that I would insta call this. With his shortish stacksize I was really on the fence here.

[jhall23]

[ QUOTE ]
This is obviously entirely read-based, especially the minraise. Was he minraising with anything, or does the minraise indicate at least a little strength?



[/ QUOTE ]

Villian wasn't the min-raiser in this hand. He called from the button against a min-raise and then called my big re-raise.

[ QUOTE ]


I'm not a 6-max player so this could be wrong, but I would tend to give someone who's 70% VP$IP very little credit (how many hands of his had you seen?).

If you DO give him a lot of credit, how much does he know about you? If you've got a low VP$IP and don't raise much pf, he could correctly put you on monsters and push with ATC, knowing you won't call without a 3, which he knows you don't have.

EDIT: This was meant to be the devil's advocate argument for calling but it didn't work out that way. I fold this with no more information. I have had this happen recently at a table where I believed I looked like I could be pushed around based on earlier events. Without something like that do go on it's a good fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm certainly tighter then most of the table (there all 35+) but certainly not rockish. Checked my PT for the session and I was 23 vpip and 11 pfr so I am raising quite a lot pre-flop as usual. Of course a big re-raise from the blinds tends to narrow my hands down some. Certainly most of the time I have a big hand here and a small percentage I'm on a steal.

Villian definetly seems to have some PF issues by calling too many raises but post flop he has been realtively sane, though aggressive. Based on his vpip and that other re-raise hand I have with him I don't think he knows that calling over 10% of his stack pre-flop is not a good idea (I had about 50 hands on him BTW) I really don't know what ranges of hands he call's a re-raise with because as far as I can remember I was the only one who ever re-raised pre-flop. The hand I listed in my initial post is the only one I think. I certainly haven't done anything to indicate I can be pushed off hands unless he uses my tightness alone as an evidence. The whole play to me just seemed like he nailed his hand and put me on an overpair and was expecting a call.

[Allinlife]

I would call this everytime esp vs short stack and expect to see 55~JJ enough times to make it +EV.

you are getting too great of pot odd to fold this, and since threat of calling bigger bet is gone, it makes this one a very easy call for me.

[embersonfire]

I second 'Allinlife', he could just as easily be playing 1010 JJ etc... I call... Sometimes he has a set sure, but he could just as easily make this play with a lower pocket pair or the flush draw, which your a fav against