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View Poll Results: How long have you been playing winning poker?
Just show me the results, please. 0 0%
Still losing. 5 3.27%
Less than 1 month. 0 0%
1-3 months. 12 7.84%
3-6 months. 17 11.11%
6 months to 1 year. 48 31.37%
1-2 years. 52 33.99%
2-5 years. 15 9.80%
5-10 years. 3 1.96%
More than a decade. 1 0.65%
Voters: 153. You may not vote on this poll

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  #31  
Old 09-09-2005, 07:08 PM
turnipmonster turnipmonster is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 511
Default Re: Going to try playing live 1/2 for a living....

not a fact obviously, but pretty generally accepted that swings in most smaller NL games are far less than in limit.

I've said this before and I'll say it again to the OP, quit complaining, learn to play better, and move up. all the smaller party NL games are ridiculously soft.

--turnipmonster
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  #32  
Old 09-09-2005, 07:53 PM
lapoker17 lapoker17 is offline
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Posts: 183
Default Re: Going to try playing live 1/2 for a living....

Too bad they don't have .50/1.00 live.
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  #33  
Old 09-09-2005, 08:36 PM
MegumiAmano MegumiAmano is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 38
Default Re: Going to try playing live 1/2 for a living....

[ QUOTE ]
Too bad they don't have .50/1.00 live.

[/ QUOTE ]

The toke alone would kill you at this limit. It's bad enough at $2/$4.
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  #34  
Old 09-09-2005, 09:47 PM
STLantny STLantny is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 107
Default Re: Going to try playing live 1/2 for a living....

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Swings in NL are less than in limit. And its not a discussion, its a fact.

[/ QUOTE ]

Feel free to elaborate. Or shall we drop the discussion because you say it's fact?

[/ QUOTE ]

I should just let the discussion drop, becuase its a fact. But I had forum veterans to help me, so Ill pass along what I was taught. In no limit, because you are able to change bet sizes you are able to get much more money in, when you hvae a bigger edge, and less money, when you think you dont (at least for a skilled player). Hence in NL you have smaller swings. There are other mathematical reasons, btu thats the gist of it.
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  #35  
Old 09-09-2005, 10:21 PM
IgorSmiles IgorSmiles is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 18
Default Re: Going to try playing live 1/2 for a living....

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Swings in NL are less than in limit. And its not a discussion, its a fact.

[/ QUOTE ]

Feel free to elaborate. Or shall we drop the discussion because you say it's fact?

[/ QUOTE ]

I should just let the discussion drop, becuase its a fact. But I had forum veterans to help me, so Ill pass along what I was taught. In no limit, because you are able to change bet sizes you are able to get much more money in, when you hvae a bigger edge, and less money, when you think you dont (at least for a skilled player). Hence in NL you have smaller swings. There are other mathematical reasons, btu thats the gist of it.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is true. However, the converse is also true. Therefore, if you are playing correctly, you will get the correct price to draw at a wide variety of hands, and many times you will miss these draws. In a typical 1/2 game, there can be numerous callers to a $15 preflop raise. Suddenly, you will find yourself priced in on a flop as a 5/1 dog (for example). Over the long term, it is correct to draw at that hand, but you will still miss 4 out of 5 times. What happens on the turn when your oppenent pushes for the rest of yours and his stack and again, the price is too good to fold?

These hands occur routinely in the 1/2 game, and can cost you your whole stack. The same hands in limit do not cost you your whole stack.

The only way to avoid these types of hands are to fold all but the most premium of hands preflop, and if that is your strategy, there is no way you will see enough hands at B&M poker to win at this level. Becuase the real way to win at this level is to understand implied odds and drawing odds but those same odds dictate that you will take some swings.
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  #36  
Old 09-09-2005, 10:24 PM
IgorSmiles IgorSmiles is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 18
Default Re: Going to try playing live 1/2 for a living....

PS: I'm not an expert theorist nor a mathematician, but I believe most who claim the swings in limit are higher than no limit are basing this on the pretext that you will be playing a tight and conservative game. However, a tight and conservative game will not maximize your profits over the long term and definitely will be more profitable online than at your typical B&M.
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  #37  
Old 09-09-2005, 10:32 PM
xxx xxx is offline
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 29
Default Re: Going to try playing live 1/2 for a living....

[ QUOTE ]
Wow 2 votes for 1k...I'm guessing I have 2 enemies on here that would like to see me on the street and off the internet ASAP? [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Or, they could have meant limit, since it wasn't mentioned in the poll. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]
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  #38  
Old 09-09-2005, 10:45 PM
STLantny STLantny is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 107
Default Re: Going to try playing live 1/2 for a living....

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Swings in NL are less than in limit. And its not a discussion, its a fact.

[/ QUOTE ]

Feel free to elaborate. Or shall we drop the discussion because you say it's fact?

[/ QUOTE ]

I should just let the discussion drop, becuase its a fact. But I had forum veterans to help me, so Ill pass along what I was taught. In no limit, because you are able to change bet sizes you are able to get much more money in, when you hvae a bigger edge, and less money, when you think you dont (at least for a skilled player). Hence in NL you have smaller swings. There are other mathematical reasons, btu thats the gist of it.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is true. However, the converse is also true. Therefore, if you are playing correctly, you will get the correct price to draw at a wide variety of hands, and many times you will miss these draws. In a typical 1/2 game, there can be numerous callers to a $15 preflop raise. Suddenly, you will find yourself priced in on a flop as a 5/1 dog (for example). Over the long term, it is correct to draw at that hand, but you will still miss 4 out of 5 times. What happens on the turn when your oppenent pushes for the rest of yours and his stack and again, the price is too good to fold?

These hands occur routinely in the 1/2 game, and can cost you your whole stack. The same hands in limit do not cost you your whole stack.

The only way to avoid these types of hands are to fold all but the most premium of hands preflop, and if that is your strategy, there is no way you will see enough hands at B&M poker to win at this level. Becuase the real way to win at this level is to understand implied odds and drawing odds but those same odds dictate that you will take some swings.

[/ QUOTE ]

What I said only applies to long term winning players, obv losing players are going to lose faster at NL. You are assuming that you are getting odds, to put your whole stack in, in your example, you dont give numbers so I dont know whether the odds are there, but rarely do you get a 2:1 draw, that you can put your stack in and be right, ie you ARENT getting the right odds.
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  #39  
Old 09-09-2005, 10:47 PM
STLantny STLantny is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 107
Default Re: Going to try playing live 1/2 for a living....

[ QUOTE ]
PS: I'm not an expert theorist nor a mathematician, but I believe most who claim the swings in limit are higher than no limit are basing this on the pretext that you will be playing a tight and conservative game. However, a tight and conservative game will not maximize your profits over the long term and definitely will be more profitable online than at your typical B&M.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is flat out wrong. Tight and conservative is the best way to make the most possible at 99.999% of games. Gone are the days of "doyle's style", or whatever you cats call it.
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  #40  
Old 09-09-2005, 11:44 PM
Ryan Z Ryan Z is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 25
Default Re: Going to try playing live 1/2 for a living....

Does anyone else think that the OP is asking the wrong question? Perhaps he should be asking, "Is playing 1/2 NL a viable option for a living?" Hopefully, this isn't the OP's goal at the end of the road; sure, only you can determine what you want to do with your life, and don't let anyone tell you NOT to do what you love to do if you can make a living at it. But you've got to ask yourself if you're ok with putting a ceiling on your income. There isn't another bearable occupation out there where you could make, say $25-50,000? I don't see how you could make anything more than that playing 1-2 NL for a living.

Perhaps I'm just biased by the belief that I could make more money than that doing something other than playing 1-2 NL. Truthfully, I think this month's magazine addresses this subject well, between Dr. Al and Ed Miller. Who knows what the tables will be like in 5 years? Right now I'm a college student and can get by making <$10,000 a year. But what about having kids? Dental insurance? Health insurance? Mortgage payments? I don't see any way you could put the weight of a house on a 1/2 NL table. I'm probably rambling right now. I apologize if I am. But sometimes I wonder if "going pro" is an option that too many people think is realistic.

-ryan
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