QQ Hand

[Boris]

[ QUOTE ]
You can't fold your hand. Even if you know you're beat, just show it down and look stupid. I like the play on the turn & river, actually. There is one thing that I don't like, though: you said you THOUGHT ABOUT IT. Never do this. You don't want people to think about anything, nor let them know that you can be made a little uncomfortable. Just call it down in a flash. If you do have to think about it, try to learn to BS them while you buy yourself some time.

[/ QUOTE ]

This advice is insane. The pot wasn't all that big until he 3 bet me on the turn. Plus he has to be scared of me since I'm the one in the sb and could easily have some random 2 pair bs hand. At some point in the hand you have to start thinking that one pair is no good and after getting 3 bet by a guy who appears to be over his head, it's as good a time as any. Also players at 30-60 and above think about things all the time. It's not like I'm letting out a big secret.

I agree about the pre-flop and flop decisions. I played this one bad.

[J.A.Sucker]

I disagree. I know what you are saying, but I think it's a bad habit to get into. My 7th grade art teacher, Mr. McHugh used to always say "draw what you see, not what you think is there." The problem with folding in spots like this is often you begin to see things that aren't there. You can't help it, and then you're hurting badly because when you sit down on a park bench, you get splinters in your ass since your wallet doesn't have any padding left in it.

[Boris]

You're speaking in generalities with no particular connection to the hand in question. You're telling me if Vu or Gerry the prop 3 bets you on the turn you call him down with one pair? please.

[J.A.Sucker]

I do. I'm not saying it's right, but I do.

[Lawrence Ng]

Preflop slanders aside on Boris, I would like to think more what his opponents put Boris on in this particular hand since Boris did not raise preflop and had the sb after a few limpers. Boris range of hands could be very wide here. J-5 suit, J-3 suited, 3-5 suited or offsuit, along with 33,55 could all be very likely hands since Boris only called an extra half bet.

So this makes for a very interesting post flop play IMHO because what we have is essentially a pretty good board for QQ OOP. My first choice would probably have been to bet, 3-bet and squeeze the damn gutshots and 5 outers for all the damn value I can.

But the way Boris plays it, it smells more like a set. But that's just the way I see it and I don't know how Boris' opponents perceive him at the table and whether or not they even bother to pay attention to how Boris plays big hands.

I don't really like the turn check-raise here and I am finding that in spots where I am OOP with possibly the best hand I like the bet a lot more than the check-raise on this particular board with this particular line-up. Straight forward play seems to be best and betting out garners for more information regarding the strength of your hand so that opponents have to give you some degree of respect for your hand. Check-raises are are overrated for textbook reasons like giving the damn free card, and ultimately facing a 3-bet with a good but not great hand putting you in a tough bind.

Am I the only one who likes the check-call on the river? Everything to this point heavily suggests my opponent might have a set here. Sure he may have KJ, QJ, and the likelihood of a counterfeited 2 pair, but I don't see how betting this river can be for value based on how Boris had shown aggression and his opponent even more aggression.

Lawrence

[DcifrThs]

[ QUOTE ]
Since we've decided that $40-$80 counts as "high limit", here goes...

[/ QUOTE ]

i think JAsucker mentioned this but id like to reiterate: 40/80 is PLENTY big. since ive been playing the paradise game alot its apparant how big that game is. seems more than 33%>30/60.

Barron

[SinCityGuy]

[ QUOTE ]
anyway what i said was preflop obviously we raise most of the time but calling sometimes is okay. remember, it's the play sklansky likes, let's not go into why it's still better to raise, bottom line is calling can have it's merit.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sklansky said that it's OK not to raise QQ in the big blind after multiple limpers (although I raise it every time). I don't think he's ever advocated just completing the small blind with QQ.

[haakee]

I seriously thought this was one of those hands from the opponent's perspective. I raise QQ here preflop 100% of the time. If you want to be deceptive with a bunch of limpers then get aggro in the SB with hands that play well multiway like QJs instead of slowplaying QQ. You can get a lot of extra money in there preflop as a guaranteed favorite here. And like Sucker said, somebody else may re-pop it with a worse hand. What was your rationale here?

Also, failing to raise preflop you really should bet the flop. If it gets checked around that really sucks. Depending upon the action you can figure out what to do from there, and it will probably be jamming the pot.

Turn and river are fine.

[Boris]

[ QUOTE ]
I seriously thought this was one of those hands from the opponent's perspective.

[/ QUOTE ]

Who'd ya think played the hand? David Sklansky?

[mike l.]

"Sklansky said that it's OK not to raise QQ in the big blind after multiple limpers (although I raise it every time). I don't think he's ever advocated just completing the small blind with QQ."

dude it's almost the same concept. he will think completing is right for the same reasons.