AA against LAG - Page 3

wackjob · #21 12-14-2005, 09:34 PM

I think I would go almost always for a 3-bet on the flop vs. a LAG. I don't think he is going to fold here, but there is the possibility that you will not get to raise the turn. I have found a lot of LAG's lately who will go crazy on the flop only to check the turn and call down once they realize you are not folding and I end up kicking myself for not getting at least an extra SB on the flop.

DeathDonkey · #22 12-14-2005, 10:04 PM

I like flop play. I cap the turn and think about raising a blank river. No way does he play QQ this way. He checkraised the flop! You have him beat sooo often here.

-DeathDonkey

oreogod · #23 12-15-2005, 04:05 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I like flop play. I cap the turn and think about raising a blank river. No way does he play QQ this way. He checkraised the flop! You have him beat sooo often here.

-DeathDonkey

[/ QUOTE ]

You play good.

cartman · #24 12-15-2005, 04:33 AM

I like 3-betting the flop, especially if he is prone to going nuts with a draw or top pair, but calling and raising the turn is fine too and may even be better. Once he 3-bets you on the turn I think you are rarely in front, so you should just call him down. Faced with 3 cold preflop you capped it and he has to know that means business. He calls damn near 4 cold in the SB then checkraises you on the flop and doesn't bat an eye when you raise him on the turn. I would be really surprised if he doesn't have the other two Aces or a set. The fact that you have the Ace of diamonds removes the possibility that he has the nut flush draw while also reducing the probability of a pair + flush draw hand. I can conceive of him holding KdQd or QdJd, but I don't think he has them often enough to merit any further aggression on your part.

Cartman

einbert · #25 12-15-2005, 04:54 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I like flop play. I cap the turn and think about raising a blank river. No way does he play QQ this way. He checkraised the flop! You have him beat sooo often here.

-DeathDonkey

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know the lag in question but against a person described as "winning" this is absolutely insane.

When he threebets the turn the only possible hand we can beat is KK, and after we capped preflop and slowplayed this flop in order to raise the turn he has to put us on KK-AA, with the possibility of AQ. His range can't possibly be wider than KK-AA, QQ, 99. Besides it doesn't make sense for him to play KK this hard if he has any clue of handreading (it would make more sense for him to play it fast on a board with no Q, but with a Q on board he is beaten by any hands that might give him so much action, ie QQ, AA both beat him, JJ will give him no action.

DeathDonkey · #26 12-15-2005, 05:06 AM

[ QUOTE ]
he has to put us on KK-AA, with the possibility of AQ.

[/ QUOTE ]

I totally disagree with this. If it were that easy my turn semibluff raises would actually work from time to time.

[ QUOTE ]
His range can't possibly be wider than KK-AA, QQ, 99

[/ QUOTE ]

Even if this is his range we are even money to have him beat!

-DeathDonkey

einbert · #27 12-15-2005, 05:13 AM

KK has to be discounted. Entity said he is a winning player, he has to have SOME hand-reading ability. He saw entity, a tight player, coldcap and then slowplay this flop in order to raise the turn. If he has KK he is easily giving too much action by threebetting.

Besides that, even if we are 50% to win capping doesn't make any sense at all. He is going to checkraise the river when he has us beat and just call down when we have him beat. There is simply no way that capping can be better than calling down here unless we give him a very wide range of hands, which if he has a very wide range of hands here I think it's hard to see how he can be a winning player. This is a pretty basic handreading spot for him and I don't see how he can put entity on anything less than KK.

einbert · #28 12-15-2005, 05:18 AM

[ QUOTE ]
A turn cap is too much. Just call down, planning to raise an A, 2 or 3 on the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

A 2 or 3 doesn't change anything here.

kiddo · #29 12-15-2005, 08:40 AM

[ QUOTE ]
the decision of how to play this hand really depends on hand range so its pretty much impossible to answer

[/ QUOTE ]

Yep, but how often he attacks and bluffs is also a part of it.

If he is prepared to fold AQ or KQ if we raise turn we should 3bet flop.

If he is prepared to checkraise a lot on this flop with medium pairs and semibluffs as AK we should think about calling down.

Danenania · #30 12-15-2005, 09:36 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I like flop play. I cap the turn and think about raising a blank river. No way does he play QQ this way. He checkraised the flop! You have him beat sooo often here.

-DeathDonkey

[/ QUOTE ]

Agree. A winning player didn't call PF with Q9, and no one on earth checkraises that flop with a set. He either has 99 or we're splitting or we have him beat. Having him beat is mathematically most likely by far.

Edit: that said if some people think based on firsthand experience with him that he won't ever 3-bet that turn with KK/AQ/KQs then sure just call down. But the op says he's laggy and it's not past a laggy player to 3-bet any of those imo.