QQ facing a weird flop raise

[West]

The thing is, if he has top pair or better and is ahead, what about the board is risky to him? If he can get another 175 out of you drawing to 2 or 3 outs, isn't that a good risk for him? If raising more gets you to fold QQ, but raising what he did gets you to call and consider putting more in the pot on later streets without improving, then his raise is perfect.

Calling the raise does accomplish one thing, and that is to force him to put in more money on later streets if he is on a bluff in order to win the pot. Maybe he's not willing to do that, and it will get checked down.

175 chips is not insignificant to you at this point though, so I'd mostly expect to just fold and give him credit for his hand. If he's bluffing, he picked a pretty risky spot to bluff in, against an EP raise on an ace high flop.

[Seadood228]

What if it were soooooooted?? I think there are a lot of really good and really bad players that will call an UTG raise in position with a weak ace in position. It tends to be the ones in between that will fold this.

[EverettKings]

I don't know what kind of turn action could possibly give you more information on the hand. You call, check the turn. If he bets anything, say 200 or 400 or whatever, what does that mean to you? If he checks and the river is a blank? If you plan to evaluate a turn bet you should know now what action you're looking for. The way I see it, you're either going to face more bets with a marginal holding out of position, or see weak action that leaves you clueless as to where you are.

It seems to me that you're looking for an excuse to continue with the hand; you want to believe he's bluffing. Yeah I guess he might be, but he's representing a better hand and you're in an ugly spot to test him. I know you're getting good odds on the call, but I feel like flop calls like that are more likely to make you talk yourself into calling off more chips on the river than to win you the pot.

Kings

[West]

A really good player is not going to call in that position with a weak suited ace. Suited aces need very good implied odds, because they flop a flush draw only about as often as a pair flops a set. But when you flop a set, you've got a monster, whereas when you flop a flush draw, you've got...just a draw. Even when you flop your draw, you may just end up getting your money in in a coin flip - if you're lucky (lets say EP raise has AQ, you have A7s, flop comes Q high with your draw...he's now almost a 2 to 1 favorite, so by getting "lucky" and flopping your draw, you now have the opportunity to get all your money in as a big underdog.)

When you don't flop your draw, you give yourself the opportunity to hit top pair while dominated. Or hit 2nd or third pair without knowing whether it's any good. It's like giving the other guy nice implied odds, and yourself reverse implied odds.

In short, calling heads up against an EP raiser with a weak suited ace mostly just gives you a great opportunity to bleed/lose chips.

[Benal]

[ QUOTE ]
ok, I called and turn is 6 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], goes check check. River card is Kh, what's your action?

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey Gavin, It would suck to fold the best hand by checking and have him make a bet you can't call. Pot is about 800.. I'd bet out 500.. this to me would look like a bet that wants a call. Fold to a raise. You still have about 1600 chips, more than enough to work with.

Or you can always check/fold [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Seadood228]

Amir Vahedi did this to me twice in two hours on level on at a Legends tourney, as did Men the Master. I've also seen Negreanu call a raise in position with even shallower stacks at the Plaza. I would never do it, but there are plenty of world class players who'll make this preflop call with position.

[mts]

small flop raise and turn check behind is weak [censored]

problem with betting is your only getting called by hands that beat you so check/call up to whatever amount you think.

400 you need to win 1 out of 3.
200 you need to win 1 out of 5.