Are you guys in autobet mode if you raise pre flop?

[Maurader1]

If you bet the flop and get called in one spot (probably against some small pp), do you check the turn on a blank (that doesn't help flush nor straight draws)? or do you bet again? if you check and he bets, then is it a clear fold?

I'm having huge problems with this also in my 1/2 games at party..

[chipolino]

I don't know man. I think this is one of those times that your AK ain't looking that pretty anymore. Can't win them all. Maybe I'm just too weak-tight hehe [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[@bsolute_luck]

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I don't know man. I think this is one of those times that your AK ain't looking that pretty anymore. Can't win them all. Maybe I'm just too weak-tight hehe [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

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to check/fold? yeah i think that is weak tight. some schmoe plays J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] and bets, so you fold because "i don't think i'm going to win because i didn't hit anything on the flop" is sad to me.

i'm not advocating betting the turn or 3-betting or any such nonsense. i'm merely talking about the flop play. so an A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] falls on the turn, you gonna check/fold when bet because "someone definitely has the flush or they wouldn't have called my preflop and flop bet"? you'll lose and fold winners all the time.

[droolie]

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If you bet the flop and get called in one spot (probably against some small pp), do you check the turn on a blank (that doesn't help flush nor straight draws)? or do you bet again? if you check and he bets, then is it a clear fold?

I'm having huge problems with this also in my 1/2 games at party..

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This is the 100,000,000 question. There are many variables to consider...
Being OOP sucks in these situations.

Look at the board texture. Could he be chasing a draw? If so he will fold if the river if the obvious draws don't come through.
What do you know about the guy? Will he always bet if checked to or only if he has a hand? (not everyone bets when checked to!!) Does he often peel one off? If so a turn bet might chase him away. If he's a calling station who calls down with any kind of piece of the flop you know you're in trouble. If he's usually aggressive and now is only calling he's probably drawing.

How much money is in the pot? You have to consider what the odds are. You will often be betting 1BB to win 8 or more. This is often a good gamble HU. The bigger the bigger the pot the more likely he's chasing.

You will usually want to see the river so you need to ask yourself if you want to call a raise or not. If you want to see the river but don't want to pay 2 bets checking is probably better. If you don't mind calling a raise just bet. If you can safely fold to a raise just bet.

[Maurader1]

Say for argument, that you are certain he has a small pp, that is smaller than the high card on the board - is it worth betting flop/turn/river to drive him out of the hand? I guess this is very read dependent, and to get a feeling for such a response, wouldn't you need a pretty big sample size? I think that a passive player would not bet a small pp, but even an aggressive player with pp might not bet, wanting a cheap showdown no?

[chipolino]

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i'm not advocating betting the turn or 3-betting or any such nonsense. i'm merely talking about the flop play. so an A falls on the turn, you gonna check/fold when bet because "someone definitely has the flush or they wouldn't have called my preflop and flop bet"? you'll lose and fold winners all the time.

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If this is the case on the turn I won't fold either. But then again this is just another case of "what if this falls or that falls". We can go on speculating here forever and don't get anywhere. One thing is for sure, if I check this flop I ain't calling a bet. If was planning to call I would rather come out firing and let them do the calling. Now, do I bet? Well I did on that hand hehe. But was it worth it on such a crappy board? You seem to think that's the way to go. I'm not really sure(but leaning more to not betting) after reading "Playing Overcards" in SSHE.
Just trying to keep on learning this game.

[johnc]

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you see nothing, i see a live hand worth a bet. you see a board that hit someone; i see a hand that might have missed them. you see getting "married" to a hand; i see a hand i can get away from.

different perspectives i guess. check/fold all day if you want. i think it is poor poker.

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I see someone hopelessly chasing. You may want to re-read the section on reverse implied odds in SSHE, it pretty much sums it up.

[KaiShin]

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Are you guys in autobet mode if you raise pre flop?

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Short answer no, with a but. Long answer yes, with an if.

In this situation, with a small field on the flop, I would make a continuation bet.

[johnc]

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Playing overcards is one of the toughest things to do and yet is a critically important skill to have because it comes up all the time. If you are a tight player you will be faced with this dilemna as much as 50% of the hands you enter in any one session. Auto-betting because you raised pf is a pretty big mistake IMO.

I look at raising pf as similar to doubling down black jack. When you think your hand is best get your money in the pot. However once the flop comes down hand values change dramatically. You need to adjust to this change in value or else you'll be spewing chips. The hand you posted is a terrific example of this. Your AKo suddenly looks like a very weak drawing hand with only two cards to go to me. You're drawing to top pair, your [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] outs are dirty, the chance of reverse domanition is large and your opponents probably are ahead now or with stronger draws that a flop bet will never drive away. It doesn't seem fair that your AKo that you patiently waited for is suddenly a big underdog to the like of any idiot who limped in with A4o or even 57s but them are the breaks.

I raise pf anywhere from 10-12% of the time and yet wind up check calling or even check folding in these types of flops all the time. The responses I get in the chat box are quite funny from time to time. (it realy pisses people off when after raising pf you check/ fold and they're sitting on a monster hoping you'll help them pump the pot)

Checking these flops (especially in EP) often gives you more accurate information than merely auto-betting to. If you auto-bet you often scare passive players in calling you down with a small pair but rarely scares them into folding. You lose the max when you are behind. This especially sucks in EP when you can't seem to give up trying to drive someone away and feel you have to keep representing AA. The only time you can get out of the hand is when someone has a monster and raises you. Even then most players feel obliged to at least call and see the next street so as to not fold on the same street. You just wasted two bets trying to drive players off of a hand much of the time. I'm not saying it is always wrong to bet with overcards but pick your spots. When the pot is being contested 4+ ways it is pretty unlikely you'll steal a pot. The only time everyone will fold is usually when they all missed too.

Something to remember is that when you raise pf they don't know you have overcards. They often assume you do but their bets or raises usually mean something. Even if they think you missed with overcards they have to fear you have a high pocket pair until you prove otherwise. Them testing you usually means they have something. It won't necessarily be something that can beat the hand you are drawing to but will almost certainly be a hand that is currently beating your overcrads or is drawing to something better than your overcards are drawing to. Telling the table you missed the flop is not such a bad thing. If they are paying attention they will immediately guess you have overcards which will allow you to bluff if a high card hits such as a K when you actually have AQ. You therefore have more outs than you really do because you not only have the outs that make your hand but the ones that look like they make your hand too. You'd be surprised how much these types of bluffs will work against players who are even remotely paying attention. Against calling stations don't bother though.

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Couldn't have said it better!

[LoaferGee12]

I'm autobetting w/ 2 or less in. Any more, and it depends completely on the situation.