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#71
12-10-2005, 07:45 PM
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Re: Iran
[ QUOTE ]
Why do you getto decide what Iranian fears arelegitimate and what are not. They cannot repel any sort of military attack from the US or Israel without nuclear weapons. [/ QUOTE ] The rest of the world gets to decide because they are the aggressor, and thus in the wrong. It logically follows from your views that you think Iran has a "right" to threaten to "wipe Israel off the face of the earth" and to support terrorism against Israel or the US. It is clear that this is your hidden agenda, for without those intentions Iran will never be subject to attack by Israel or the US. 
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#72
12-10-2005, 07:52 PM
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Re: Iran
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Why do you getto decide what Iranian fears arelegitimate and what are not. They cannot repel any sort of military attack from the US or Israel without nuclear weapons. [/ QUOTE ] The rest of the world gets to decide because they are the aggressor, and thus in the wrong. It logically follows from your views that you think Iran has a "right" to threaten to "wipe Israel off the face of the earth" and to support terrorism against Israel or the US. It is clear that this is your hidden agenda, for without those intentions Iran will never be subject to attack by Israel or the US. [/ QUOTE ] You should review your history of the middle east. In the 1950's the US sponsered a coup d'eta against the newly democratic Iran. We reinstalled the brutal Shah and thus two decades of US sponsered totalitarianism resulted. The Ayotolla finally overthrew the US backed Shah and created the modern state of Iran. Meanwhile the US backed state of Israel was pursuing their expansionist agenda only a few hundred miles away. Iran has been messed with by the Us far more than you realize and has every right to fear it will be in the future.
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#73
12-10-2005, 08:01 PM
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Re: Iran
[ QUOTE ]
Meanwhile the US backed state of Israel was pursuing their expansionist agenda only a few hundred miles away. [/ QUOTE ] At the root of all the arugments of such posters as yourself is a hatred for Israel. So much so that you don't care about the nature or intentions of any enemy of theirs. And Israel only expanded after its creation by defeating enemies who either attacked it first or were about too. But of course none of that matters to you. Your anti-Semitic views and rationalizations are ugly.
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#74
12-10-2005, 08:04 PM
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Re: Iran
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Meanwhile the US backed state of Israel was pursuing their expansionist agenda only a few hundred miles away. [/ QUOTE ] At the root of all the arugments of such posters as yourself is a hatred for Israel. So much so that you don't care about the nature or intentions of any enemy of theirs. And Israel only expanded after its creation by defeating enemies who either attacked it first or were about too. But of course none of that matters to you. Your anti-Semitic views and rationalizations are ugly. [/ QUOTE ] Please calm down and answer with rational on topic replys. I said nothing anti semetic, I merely recited facts. Isreal justified their expansion with a spoils of war type mentality (one which has been largely abandoned since the beginning of the 20th century)but any justification does not disguise the fact that were clearly one of the most aggressive expansionist powers in the middle east since WWII.
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#75
12-10-2005, 08:14 PM
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Re: Iran
[ QUOTE ]
Nuclear weapons are obviously a terrible weapon which the world wouldprobably be betteroff without. HOwever from a Game theory pov if one has them then everyone shoul d have tehm. The situation is far more dangerous when one power can nuke anotherwith no fear of represuccions. Thebest idea is to create a senario where offensive nukes are a losing proposition. [/ QUOTE ] This might well have applied with regard the former USSR and the USA, but it does not equally apply to regimes which are radical, unstable, or in cohorts with terrorists.
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#76
12-10-2005, 08:24 PM
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Re: Iran
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Nuclear weapons are obviously a terrible weapon which the world wouldprobably be betteroff without. HOwever from a Game theory pov if one has them then everyone shoul d have tehm. The situation is far more dangerous when one power can nuke anotherwith no fear of represuccions. Thebest idea is to create a senario where offensive nukes are a losing proposition. [/ QUOTE ] This might well have applied with regard the former USSR and the USA, but it does not equally apply to regimes which are radical, unstable, or in cohorts with terrorists. [/ QUOTE ] The international system is based on rational actors. Unfortunatly there is no judge of rationality. Iran has done nothing to warrant any doubt of its rationality. Keep in mind that the US has sponsered terrorists in Cuba, Afganistan, and Nicaragua. Sponsoring terrorists in this case is a piss poor measure of rationality.
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#77
12-10-2005, 08:27 PM
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Re: Iran
In addition the united states is the only nation to have violently used nuclear weapons. We are not in the clear just because we are 'the good guys'. We must apply stringent standards of moral behaviour to ourselves as well as to 'terrorist states'.
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#78
12-10-2005, 09:12 PM
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Re: Iran
[ QUOTE ]
Iran has done nothing to warrant any doubt of its rationality. [/ QUOTE ] Except for that penchant for calling for the extermination of an entire country... Oh and sponsering terrorism against said country. Quit trolling, dude.
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#79
12-10-2005, 09:15 PM
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Re: Iran
[ QUOTE ]
In addition the united states is the only nation to have violently used nuclear weapons. We are not in the clear just because we are 'the good guys'. We must apply stringent standards of moral behaviour to ourselves as well as to 'terrorist states'. [/ QUOTE ] You think? Yeah, we used them. And in all the conflicts we've been in since, we've never used them. Weatherman's comment previously about us dropping the atomic bombs "without batting an eye" is just plain wrong. There have been many eyes batted then and since about whether to drop the bombs.
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#80
12-10-2005, 09:29 PM
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Re: Iran
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Iran has done nothing to warrant any doubt of its rationality. [/ QUOTE ] Except for that penchant for calling for the extermination of an entire country... Oh and sponsering terrorism against said country. Quit trolling, dude. [/ QUOTE ] First off they seek to destroy the government, not outright genocide. This makes them no different than the US giving Saddam a 24 hour ultimatum. As I have already mentioned the Us has sponsored terrorism in numerous theaters and so Iran is once again no different.
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