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#1
12-15-2005, 09:12 PM
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I call too much on the flop
Sorry if this seems like a really boring hand. I'm posting because I realized recently that I've taken the whole "loose flop call" idea too far - sometimes I just automatically call when I bet the flop and get raised, without really thinking it through.
Its a mid-afternoon game and the table is full of regulars and off-duty dealers (ones who know how to play). Most players are solid but aren't playing their A-game - everyone's playing a bit more loose-passive, "friendly" game. The only mistaken that I'm seeing made consistently is cold-calling too much. The specific players are mostly unknown, but are all at least somewhat thinking. We're 8 handed at the moment. PF Hero is UTG with T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="red">Hero raises</font>, 2 folds, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, LP folds, Button calls, SB folds, BB calls. Flop (5 players, 10.5 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="red">hero bets</font>, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, button folds, <font color="red">BB raises</font>, Hero... 
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#3
12-15-2005, 09:24 PM
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Re: I call too much on the flop
[ QUOTE ]
Super easy fold for me. Even if he's raising the flush draw for value and the caller doesn't have an ace, you're going to get outdrawn around 50% of the time. Scott [/ QUOTE ] This statement looks good to me. By the way if you do feel compelled to make a loose call like this for metagame purposes, try to make sure you have atleast 2 outs. In your hand the Th may not even be an out. Th
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#4
12-15-2005, 09:52 PM
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Re: I call too much on the flop
ya this is a solid fold. You really only have 1 out and A's are sooo likely in the small stakes. so chances are you are behind drawing to 1 out or if there is a slight chance you are ahead they have a lot of outs against you. ( [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]'s+)
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#5
12-15-2005, 10:23 PM
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Re: I call too much on the flop
Sorry, I forgot to mention that this is 8-16 (live). It's the biggest game in this cardroom, and probably close to the biggest in the area w/o going to a tribal casino, so it plays a bit higher than you'd expect (but not too much).
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#7
12-15-2005, 11:23 PM
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Re: I call too much on the flop
I'm folding here. Also is the flop bet even neccessary? I think check/call could be an option. However myself I would still bet.
JT [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
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#8
12-16-2005, 12:07 AM
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Re: I call too much on the flop
Thanks for everyone's input. I guess this one was a real no-brainer - sorry for the clutter. I did fold, and MP folded right behind me, so I never got to see what BB had. I guess it felt a little wierd because I had trouble putting BB on a hand. I suppose this is one of those situation where its not important what he had, because he's got something good, the pot isn't huge, there a player behind me who could have something, and even if I'm ahead my equity can't be that high.
to JT: I thought the flop bet here was pretty mandatory - my hand is really vulnerable, there are lots of QJ type hands that will likely fold to my bet, and its an easy fold if I get raised.
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#9
12-16-2005, 10:55 AM
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Re: I call too much on the flop
[ QUOTE ]
I'm posting because I realized recently that I've taken the whole "loose flop call" idea too far - sometimes I just automatically call when I bet the flop and get raised, without really thinking it through. [/ QUOTE ] I'm super guilty of this, too. Sometimes I really screw up and 3-bet, which either makes Villian cap it, or call me down with a better hand. This is royally stupid of me, and I'm working hard to stop myself from doing it.
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#10
12-16-2005, 12:51 PM
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Re: I call too much on the flop
If BB is indeed behind you he is in position to make a play, seeing as MP1 did not raise this flop. There is a chance MP1 is on a flush draw or just a weak ace playing passively. And if BB is on a flush draw his play is simple. Getting value plus an added chance to win by raising. If this player check-raises often I would be more suspicious.
That said, the board is one that should look great to an UTG preflop raiser holding AK or AQ. The math and reasoning as mentioned by other posters should make this a clear fold. Even if BB is running at you there are too many things working against... 1) MP1 yet to act 2) any [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3) the other 9 overcards 4) T [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] may be no good
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