Turn c/r'd...played optimally?

TheHammer24 · #1 12-02-2005, 01:58 AM

Average villian here. Straight forward, but kind of loose. Average agression. Something like 25/5/1.8

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (7 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
1 fold, MP1 calls, Hero calls, CO calls, 1 fold, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, MP1 checks, Hero bets, CO folds, SB folds, BB folds, MP1 calls.

Turn: (3.50 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP1 checks, Hero bets, MP1 raises, Hero calls.

River: (7.50 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP1 bets, Hero raises, MP1 calls.

Final Pot: 11.50 BB

Was forgoing the turn raise until the river optimal. FWIW, I was raising almost every river card here. Is this lose the least win the most type situation?

jt1 · #2 12-02-2005, 02:11 AM

the way you played it, you can just call a diamond river. And, ironically, that'd be the only loss - if a diamond happend to hit, lol

MP is dumb (even if he does have the boat)

McGahee · #3 12-02-2005, 02:16 AM

I don't know how much it matters but it looks a bit like FPS to me - did you have reason to believe he'd fold to a turn 3-bet?

hobbsmann · #4 12-02-2005, 02:17 AM

perfect.

silkyslim · #5 12-02-2005, 02:20 AM

I dont get it. why would he fold to a 3 bet? can u explain why this line is awesome and 3 betting is not so awesome?

hobbsmann · #6 12-02-2005, 02:27 AM

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I dont get it. why would he fold to a 3 bet? can u explain why this line is awesome and 3 betting is not so awesome?

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a 3-bet lets average queens off the hook. By calling and raising the river villain with often call because he is confussed by our line.

GuyOnTilt · #7 12-02-2005, 07:01 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I dont get it. why would he fold to a 3 bet? can u explain why this line is awesome and 3 betting is not so awesome?

[/ QUOTE ]
a 3-bet lets average queens off the hook. By calling and raising the river villain with often call because he is confussed by our line.

[/ QUOTE ]
You are giving your opponent way too much credit. 3bet the turn.

GoT

TheHip41 · #8 12-02-2005, 07:11 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I dont get it. why would he fold to a 3 bet? can u explain why this line is awesome and 3 betting is not so awesome?

[/ QUOTE ]
a 3-bet lets average queens off the hook. By calling and raising the river villain with often call because he is confussed by our line.

[/ QUOTE ]

No one in the history of the world at Party 2/4 is every folding a Q after they raised it on the turn. They are 'trapping' by waiting until the turn to raise. If he folds to a 3 bet he was on air anyway.

Pharity · #9 12-02-2005, 07:18 AM

Raise the turn. This guy will not fold to a 3bet after he checkraises you. There is a big risk that he will not bet the river allowing you to raise. He is more likely to pay off the 3-bet and a river bet (with a queen perhaps) than both betting *and paying off your river raise. And if he is on a diamond draw its only on the turn he will be paying you off.

thejameser · #10 12-02-2005, 09:30 AM

3 bet the turn. get your money in while you are most often ahead. a diamond, a Q, a straight card, etc. could come and somewhat cripple the power of your holding. that, and 2/4 players suck and like to call down with top pair to keep you honest are enough reason, IMO. here it seems to work out, but if you only call his turn raise you are giving him too cheap of a river card. plus, on the turn he may have a hard time putting you on a six since you bet the flop(he probably put you on a pair of queens, i don't know).