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Old 10-24-2005, 07:16 PM
Vee Quiva Vee Quiva is offline
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Default Should I bet at this high flop LO8/B?

1-2 LO 8/B at Party Poker
I'm in Big blind with T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
3 callers and small blind completes, I check.
5 small bets to flop

Flop: 9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Check, I bet. One call, and everyone else folds. Heads up to the turn for 3.5 Big Bets

I bet to make the low draws pay to draw. Should I have checked to try and pull more people in with my flush draw?

Turn: J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I bet to keep pressure on. Opponent Check Raises. I call hoping for a diamond.

River K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

I check, Opponent bets. Should I call with low end of the straight?
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Old 10-24-2005, 09:07 PM
Burdzthewurd Burdzthewurd is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2005
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Default Re: Should I bet at this high flop LO8/B?

Yes

You're likely to see T8xx or something like top two here more than the times you'll be shown ATdxx, or ATQJ, some weird hand like that.
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Old 10-25-2005, 12:38 AM
Buzz Buzz is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2002
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Posts: 598
Default Re: Should I bet at this high flop LO8/B?

[ QUOTE ]
Check, I bet. One call, and everyone else folds. Heads up to the turn for 3.5 Big Bets

I bet to make the low draws pay to draw. Should I have checked to try and pull more people in with my flush draw?

[/ QUOTE ]

Vee - No. If you're going to play this flop with your hand from the big blind, I think you should bet (just as you did). You don't want to pull people in! Your 4th nut flush draw is probably a loser! You do not have a good hand/flop fit here. But with this particular flop, maybe nobody else has a good fit either.

[ QUOTE ]
Should I call with low end of the straight?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes. Your opponent might be betting here with anything at all, not necessarily a higher straight than yours. Considering the size of the pot, if your opponent is betting something less than a straight only one time out of eight, your call is correct.

The first, second and fourth betting rounds are very straightforward for you.

It is the third betting round, a betting round you didn't ask about, that requires the most complex decision from you. You wrote:

[ QUOTE ]
Turn: J[heat]

I bet to keep pressure on.

[/ QUOTE ]

Who are you keeping the pressure on?

The small blind called your flop bet after checking.

I think you should ask yourself why.

SB originally checked this flop, but then, after all your other opponents had folded, called your bet. What could SB hold to play this way? Could SB simply be playing horribly and chasing the low half of the pot with just one opponent after this flop?

That's possible, I suppose. Maybe SB is clueless. And if that's the case, and in case SB incidentally has an ace or a pair, maybe you don’t want SB getting a free last card.

But if you give SB credit for knowing the game at all, I think you have to put SB on some kind of fit with the flop for high. Maybe a set. Maybe better diamonds than you. Maybe a wrap-around straight draw. Maybe some combination of these with a pair.... Something.

And whatever that something is, it's probably better than what you, yourself, hold after this flop. All you have is a pair, a poor flush draw, a poor non-nut straight draw, and some runner-runner (backdoor) possibilities.

Your bet after this flop was a sort of semi-bluff. That was fine (correct, I think) - but then when SB calls, you have to back off and re-assess the situation.

I think you should at least be wary of the possibility SB has some sort of fit for high with this flop.

And therefore, I think you use your position best by checking after SB checks the turn to you.

When you’re wary, you set up some sort of defense. Defense makes good sense and is essential in football, national security, bridge, boxing, and also in Omaha-8 poker. What’s the defense here? You simply check the turn after your opponent checks to you.

As it turns out you bet and got check-raised. But your reason for checking after SB checks is not as much the danger of getting check-raised as the sheer futility of betting to try to steal the pot. You cannot much like the jack of hearts on the turn, because the jack of hearts enables a straight for your opponent or possibly gives your opponent two pairs. Probably your opponent had a better fit with this flop than you. And now possibly your opponent has improved, while you have not.

In my humble opinion, you should <font color="red">check</font> the turn.

[ QUOTE ]
Opponent Check Raises. I call hoping for a diamond.

[/ QUOTE ]

Whatever. I like calling this check raise better than folding. But you should not have gotten yourself in position to be check-raised here in the first place.

Just my opinion.

Buzz
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