AKs, call or raise the flop?

bozlax · #1 02-17-2005, 02:00 PM

Should I call this planning to raise the turn improved? Or should I raise to try and thin the field? Or would I be raising for value?

MP3 had insignificant stats (only 27 hands, and I hadn't seen him showdown a single one).

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, 1 fold, MP3 calls, Hero raises, 1 fold, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

Flop: (14 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (7 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, MP3 bets, Hero ?

Entity · #2 02-17-2005, 02:13 PM

It's rarely a value raise.

I would raise here as an attempt to thin the field, fully prepared to fold on the turn.

Rob

JapaneseSandman · #3 02-17-2005, 02:18 PM

I think I would raise here. It might get you a free card on the turn, you might buy the button and if MP3 reraises you know you are way behind. If you got a lot of cold calls of your raise then maybe call MP3's reraise other wise I'd fold to his reraise. If your still in for the turn and you hit a card for your backdoor flush or straight you might then have the odds to call it down to the river.

This is my first serious response so take it with a grain of salt.

Wang tang ting tong I am the Japanese sandman, take eight.

gvibes · #4 02-17-2005, 02:24 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I think I would raise here. It might get you a free card on the turn, you might buy the button and if MP3 reraises you know you are way behind. If you got a lot of cold calls of your raise then maybe call MP3's reraise other wise I'd fold to his reraise. If your still in for the turn and you hit a card for your backdoor flush or straight you might then have the odds to call it down to the river.

This is my first serious response so take it with a grain of salt.

Wang tang ting tong I am the Japanese sandman, take eight.

[/ QUOTE ]

I doubt it would ever be right to fold to a reraise, even if no one else comes along. You'd almost be getting pot odds on just the back door straight and flush draws (it would be ~19:1, I think).

JapaneseSandman · #5 02-17-2005, 02:29 PM

I don't know you may be right but I count the 2 backdoor draws as 2 outs and the 2 over cards as 1 out for a total of three so the pot would be big enough if you count the outs that way. How do you count them.

Wang tang ting tong I am the Japanese sandman, take eight.

gvibes · #6 02-17-2005, 02:38 PM

[ QUOTE ]
How do you count them.

[/ QUOTE ]

No idea - I think I need to review that section of SSH. If we know that he'd reraise with a nine and a nine only, then we'd need the flush, straight, or running overs. I really have no clue.

bozlax · #7 02-17-2005, 05:41 PM

I'm thinking "bets." I'm getting good odds for my 9-outer, and I can count them all as full outs. Now I'm betting for value.

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, 1 fold, MP3 calls, Hero raises, 1 fold, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

Flop: (14 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (7 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, MP3 bets, Hero raises, SB folds, BB folds, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 folds, MP3 calls.

Turn: (11 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, MP3 checks, Hero ?

Womble · #8 02-17-2005, 05:47 PM

Take that free card! I seriously doubt that your ahead here and you dont want MP3 to checkraise you.