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  #1  
Old 11-17-2005, 09:45 PM
bluefeet bluefeet is offline
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Location: galapagos islands of course
Posts: 825
Default ($27) - \"I get high..with a little help...from my friends\"

Always wanting to be the helpful one, I took part in the final bubble hand to "protect" the dead chips.

PF a risk in itself. If shortie swipes them, he has gained enough FE to put additional squeeze on me. If I join, I can help ensure his demise. If the whole thing back-fires, I am now the short-stack.

Seat 1 - crazy mo'fo. up & down like a yo-yo since 6-handed...JUST having his slowplayed AA cracked by two pair (limped PF..whoops).

Seat 4 - scared little girl. a couple MONSTER pots mid tourney, folding fast since

Seat 5 - just hit the jackpot...pretty solid player. doing his share of pushing short-handed.


Seat 1: (1005 in chips)
bluefeet (2665 in chips)
Seat 4: (3050 in chips)
Seat 5: (6780 in chips)
All Ante 25
Seat 4: posts small blind 200
Seat 5: posts big blind 400
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to bluefeet [Kd 8h]
Seat 1: raises 580 to 980 and is all-in
<font color="blue">shortie is pushing a rediculous number of hands here. as tight as SB has been, figuring my K8o possibly being ahead of shortie, i didn't want to risk BB having to call with crap. if i fold, and UTG holds, he's back to 2300ish. if either blind wants to push me off - representing a genuine hand, so be it - i'd ditch</font>
bluefeet: calls 980
Seat 4: calls 780 &lt;--- good...more help
Seat 5: calls 580 &lt;--- nice..."we" should take this down
*** FLOP *** [Th 7s 2d]
Seat 4: checks
Seat 5: checks
bluefeet: checks &lt;--- all according to plan
*** TURN *** [Th 7s 2d] <font color="blue">[Kc]</font>
Seat 4: checks
Seat 5: bets 1600 &lt;--- craaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaap!
<font color="blue">well ain't that a pisser? we have no side pot. the board isn't "scary". wtf? i'm fixin to go broke myself, with what i'm sure now is an inferior hand. but what if this bastard is bluffing? why would he bluff? why would he bet? i can "safely" go bust calling here, taking 3rd if either of us win the hand.</font>
bluefeet: ???

PF - likie?
Turn decision - ????
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  #2  
Old 11-17-2005, 09:55 PM
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Default Re: ($27) - \"I get high..with a little help...from my friends\"

Fold pre-flop. Much as I don't want shorty to get the blinds for free, I don't want to assist his tripling up, and I sure don't want to give up my chips to a push from behind (and the BB ought to be trying that a lot, I would think). I'm willing to take my chances between BB winning this one and having to attack seat 4's blinds when shorty wins this hand.

Given the predicament you've gotten yourself into, I think you probably have to call. There's a chance you've got BB out-kicked, and top pair here should beat shorty most of the time.
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  #3  
Old 11-17-2005, 10:24 PM
Messy_Jesse Messy_Jesse is offline
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Default Re: ($27) - \"I get high..with a little help...from my friends\"

[ QUOTE ]
Fold pre-flop. Much as I don't want shorty to get the blinds for free, I don't want to assist his tripling up, and I sure don't want to give up my chips to a push from behind (and the BB ought to be trying that a lot, I would think). I'm willing to take my chances between BB winning this one and having to attack seat 4's blinds when shorty wins this hand.

Given the predicament you've gotten yourself into, I think you probably have to call. There's a chance you've got BB out-kicked, and top pair here should beat shorty most of the time.

[/ QUOTE ]

Except for the last part, agreed. Calling the bet is horrible- he wouldnt do that with anything you are beating unless we are saying that he is a complete moron. Let it go, and make a stand with something that isn't a river card away from sending you home.
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  #4  
Old 11-17-2005, 10:33 PM
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Default Re: ($27) - \"I get high..with a little help...from my friends\"

[ QUOTE ]
Except for the last part, agreed. Calling the bet is horrible- he wouldnt do that with anything you are beating unless we are saying that he is a complete moron. Let it go, and make a stand with something that isn't a river card away from sending you home.

[/ QUOTE ]

You don't think BB would bet to protect Kx here? I suppose there are fewer x's hero beats than he loses to at this point, but given the chance that BB is overplaying his hand and then loses to shorty (happens all the time in my experience) I think I still lean towards calling and going out 3rd if need be.
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  #5  
Old 11-17-2005, 10:43 PM
microbet microbet is offline
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Location: Southern California
Posts: 1,360
Default Re: ($27) - \"I get high..with a little help...from my friends\"

If big stack wins this pot, you have a very slim chance of getting 1st, and you're still at a disadvantage for 2nd.

Weigh that against the reasonable chance that you outkick him, and avoiding the unlikely but horrible possibility that he is bluffing and I don't think calling is bad.

If both you and seat 5 had 4k chips, I think calling would be bad, especially given your read.
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  #6  
Old 11-17-2005, 11:07 PM
handsome handsome is offline
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Default Re: ($27) - \"I get high..with a little help...from my friends\"

Fold preflop.
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  #7  
Old 11-17-2005, 11:13 PM
microbet microbet is offline
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Location: Southern California
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Default Re: ($27) - \"I get high..with a little help...from my friends\"

Yeah, about preflop. I fold too. It's tempting and all, since he's pushing so much, but I don't think K8 is quite good enough.
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  #8  
Old 11-17-2005, 11:25 PM
bluefeet bluefeet is offline
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: galapagos islands of course
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Default Re: ($27) - \"I get high..with a little help...from my friends\"

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, about preflop. I fold too. It's tempting and all, since he's pushing so much, but I don't think K8 is quite good enough.

[/ QUOTE ]

Conversation 'off-line' w/ a poster (I'll let him identify if he wants to chime in)...

If folding is best, how about this alternative to simply calling...

Push.

Calling - check/folding (or checking down without victory) ...leaves me approximately the same amount of chips as pushing PF, losing to shortie. If I do believe I MIGHT be ahead of UTG, what do you think?

Is BB calling my push with less? Problematic maybe.
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  #9  
Old 11-17-2005, 11:30 PM
FlyWf FlyWf is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2004
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Default Re: ($27) - \"I get high..with a little help...from my friends\"

Calling is better than pushing. K8 might be ahead of shorty, but you ain't that far ahead no matter what he has, and if you lose to the shorty you are hurting bad. You want some help here. Folding the turn leaves you with the same chips as if you had pushed and lost, but those chips put you 3rd instead of 4th. Mite of a difference.

I call the turn.
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  #10  
Old 11-18-2005, 12:03 AM
gisb0rne gisb0rne is offline
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Default Re: ($27) - \"I get high..with a little help...from my friends\"

I call the turn bet, with no hesitation. I've seen too many people bluff at this or bet a weak hand. You also don't have to be that afraid of losing your chips to the BB since you will almost certainly get 3rd in that case since UTG will push with such a wide range.

I also wouldn't even seriously considering a call with K8o preflop in this situation.
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