Enough in there to cold call a praise preflop?

stabn · #1 12-19-2004, 02:43 AM

It's 9 small bets to me, and ten if the bb calls. I kto, but do i have enough implied odds with wouldn't call with kts? It's basically the most beautiful hand for me in the world postflop and i'm wondering if i'm being results oriented or if that really is enough that i should have called. I know nothing about UTG before the hand starts.
Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, MP3 folds, Hero folds, Button folds, SB folds, BB calls.

btspider · #2 12-19-2004, 02:54 AM

yeah, don't post the results after your decision.

a call is fine if no one is aggressive behind you. a fold is alright as well. i'd almost rather have QJs or JTs here.

stabn · #3 12-19-2004, 03:01 AM

I took them out. Yah i thought it was close, so i guess i'm not to wrong either way. I don't feel utg raises and Kt go well together, but since i was sutied i was just wondering if it was enough equity. Sounds like 'it depends', which is good enough for me.

topspin · #4 12-19-2004, 03:07 AM

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I took them out.

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I think he meant everything after your preflop call. Just because you rivered a full house in this case isn't a reason to call preflop.

Frankly I think that you're going to hit top pair and spew chips against AK/AT than you'll hit a miracle flop. btspider's right in that QJs or JTs is an easier call here - the straight potential helps make up for the risk of domination. It's also easier to get away from a pair of jacks than a pair of kings if you hit top pair and the preflop bettor continues to show aggression.

btspider · #5 12-19-2004, 03:09 AM

by results I mean everything beyond your decision. obviously you won the hand since you hold the nuts [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] SSH's loose chart says call, the tight chart says fold (i think).. so its really based on your read of UTG (is a raise AA/KK/AK only, etc) and your read on those behind you.

post it like this for the best responses:

UTG raises, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, MP3 folds, Hero ????

you didn't know what the flop would be or if someone would call/raise behind you.. so neither should we.

stabn · #6 12-19-2004, 03:13 AM

I think he meant everything after your preflop call. Just because you rivered a full house in this case isn't a reason to call preflop.
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I think he meant everything after your preflop call. Just because you rivered a full house in this case isn't a reason to call preflop.

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Alright, i'll skip everything after the last decision point in the future. I'm so used to OOT instead of posting hands [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]. I reedited again in case anyone else wants to comment on the preflop decision.

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Frankly I think that you're going to hit top pair and spew chips against AK/AT than you'll hit a miracle flop. btspider's right in that QJs or JTs is an easier call here - the straight potential helps make up for the risk of domination. It's also easier to get away from a pair of jacks than a pair of kings if you hit top pair and the preflop bettor continues to show aggression.

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Thanks. That was my overall but feel but there was a pretty good amount in there so i wasn't sure if i was leaving something on the table. I think i'll probably continue to fold KTs there and take your advice and see a flop with QJs and JTs.

SlantNGo · #7 12-19-2004, 03:18 AM

Is it just me or is this an easy muck? A high suited connector like QJs would be a more difficult decision. KTs can make flushes and top pair, not so much straights. Top pair right now probably isn't very good because you're facing a real possibility of getting outkicked.

stabn · #8 12-19-2004, 03:24 AM

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by results I mean everything beyond your decision.

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Gotcha.
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SSH's loose chart says call, the tight chart says fold (i think)..

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Just double checked it, it does say fold.

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so its really based on your read of UTG (is a raise AA/KK/AK only, etc) and your read on those behind you.

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The only thing i did right in my post was probably mentioning that i didn't have a read of him. At .50-1 I guess i should default to a loose raiser.

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you didn't know what the flop would be or if someone would call/raise behind you.. so neither should we

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Alright. Thanks for your help.

The13atman · #9 12-19-2004, 03:35 AM

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Is it just me or is this an easy muck? A high suited connector like QJs would be a more difficult decision. KTs can make flushes and top pair, not so much straights. Top pair right now probably isn't very good because you're facing a real possibility of getting outkicked.

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It's an easy muck for me as well. Then again, I've been called weak on more than 1 occasion. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img] Hell, I fold QJs, JTs, and KJs here as well. I dislike cold calling in all but a very few occasions.