Two Plus Two Older Archives  

Go Back   Two Plus Two Older Archives > Limit Texas Hold'em > Small Stakes Shorthanded

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 11-30-2005, 11:46 PM
SlantNGo SlantNGo is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 133
Default Folded to me in LP with a maniac in the blind

How should I adjust my open-raising range and my postflop play when it's folded to me in LP and there is a maniac in the blinds? Let's assume that there is a 80% chance I will be 3-bet (feel free to talk about how your strategy changes if we drop this to 40%). Coming from a full ring background, I didn't run into this situation much, but with a maniac behind me (to my left and not in the blinds), I tightened up a lot on my open-raises, especially on the K- and Q-high offsuits, while not so much on the Ace high ones, because I perceived them to have more showdown value (I would C/C them down unimproved if the board texture was favorable, i.e. paired).

Anyways, the particular villain in the next two hands was 80/50/4, and I've never seen him fold on any street after a pre-flop raise:

-----------------------

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is CO with Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero calls.

Flop: (7 SB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: (4.50 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (6.50 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 8.50 BB

I think I should be check/folding the river here, correct? Maybe even the turn?

-----------------

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero calls.

Flop: (7 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: (4.50 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (6.50 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 8.50 BB

I think I should just fold this pre-flop knowing that SB will 3-bet me 90% of the time. However, given that I got myself into this jam, what should I be doing on the flop? I think I can peel then check/fold the turn unimproved. Calling this down was just terrible IMO, even with the double-paired river.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 11-30-2005, 11:53 PM
Aaron W. Aaron W. is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 87
Default Re: Folded to me in LP with a maniac in the blind

[ QUOTE ]
Anyways, the particular villain in the next two hands was 80/50/4, and I've never seen him fold on any street after a pre-flop raise

[/ QUOTE ]

If he's raising 50%, and will bet every single street regardless of what falls, I don't mind playing all-in mentality poker. I find two starting cards that I like, and get ready to see a showdown (think big cards -- suited connected things don't do well in this situation because you can't get in cheaply and you'll need to show down a made hand to win). Of course, if I should hit top pair or something, I'll push for extra action, but I'm otherwise treating it like an all-in for 3 BB.

Against a player of this type, the flop, turn, and river don't matter that much -- he's betting regardless of what he has. I'd actually prefer seeing a double paired board (second hand) because this means that there's less for him to connect with and you beat some legit hands like 99.

Someone may have a better strategy than this, but I suspect it would require you to be able to control villain, and I don't think that's happening very often.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-01-2005, 12:17 AM
bobman0330 bobman0330 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 52
Default Re: Folded to me in LP with a maniac in the blind

Cap preflop, don't fold.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-01-2005, 12:26 AM
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Folded to me in LP with a maniac in the blind

Wow, if he's playing that many hands, you have to figure you are winning this hand more often. This seems to be the only way to go. I think the river call is borderline, but again, villain could have any two cards!!
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-01-2005, 12:28 AM
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Folded to me in LP with a maniac in the blind

[ QUOTE ]
I think I should just fold this pre-flop knowing that SB will 3-bet me 90% of the time. However, given that I got myself into this jam, what should I be doing on the flop? I think I can peel then check/fold the turn unimproved. Calling this down was just terrible IMO, even with the double-paired river.

[/ QUOTE ]

meh, I missed this second hand. I think the paired board increases your equity here.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-01-2005, 10:26 AM
SlantNGo SlantNGo is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 133
Default Re: Folded to me in LP with a maniac in the blind

[ QUOTE ]
If he's raising 50%, and will bet every single street regardless of what falls, I don't mind playing all-in mentality poker. I find two starting cards that I like, and get ready to see a showdown (think big cards -- suited connected things don't do well in this situation because you can't get in cheaply and you'll need to show down a made hand to win).

[/ QUOTE ]

Aaron, I was thinking much along the same lines, hence why I auto-called these down. The question is though, how low should I open-raise if I know he's gonna 3-bet me 80% of the time? Like I said, I value A-high for showdown value, so I'd probably go down to A6 here, but should I still be open-raising K9? QJ?
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-01-2005, 10:39 AM
Peter Harris Peter Harris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Edinburgh, UK
Posts: 113
Default Re: Folded to me in LP with a maniac in the blind

Hand 1: easiest of easy caps PF against a moron. I would fold the turn, and would definitely fold river.

Hand 2: i guess a calldown is fine, you may have counterfeited 3x with the river, unless SN has QQ, KK, Ax you are chopping or winning.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-01-2005, 10:42 AM
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Folded to me in LP with a maniac in the blind

The K9 has some showdown value and good high-pair strength so it is at least marginally profitable here (If you're trying to control variance, consider a fold). KQ is obviously a preflop cap against a nut.

The first hand: I'd peel one, and fold the turn. I am beat by ace-high, any joke pair, and some straight cards.
(3,4,5,6,7,A + any PP + stuff that can draw out on you like 98). However, I need to check the math on this.

The second hand: Call the flop and turn for combined reasons of drawing and likelihood of being ahead. Once you're in for 7 SB, you don't have to have 50% equity to continue.
River is an easy call: only things that beat you are AA-TT, Ax, Jx, Tx, 33.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-01-2005, 12:30 PM
Aaron W. Aaron W. is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 87
Default Re: Folded to me in LP with a maniac in the blind

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If he's raising 50%, and will bet every single street regardless of what falls, I don't mind playing all-in mentality poker. I find two starting cards that I like, and get ready to see a showdown (think big cards -- suited connected things don't do well in this situation because you can't get in cheaply and you'll need to show down a made hand to win).

[/ QUOTE ]

Aaron, I was thinking much along the same lines, hence why I auto-called these down. The question is though, how low should I open-raise if I know he's gonna 3-bet me 80% of the time? Like I said, I value A-high for showdown value, so I'd probably go down to A6 here, but should I still be open-raising K9? QJ?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think I would go as low as any ace, K7+, QT+, and all pocket pairs. This is a total of about 400 hands (about 30%) if I counted right. If I can't raise it, I'll fold it since it sounds like he's not going to let you slide in for a cheap flop. He has taken all the postflop skill out of the game, so everything rests on preflop skill. And the only preflop skill here is hand selection.

Edit: In my mind, the reason to raise is to make sure you get heads up. When he 3-bets, I'll cap only the better hands (AT+, KJ+, 88+ = 10%).
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:34 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions Inc.