5-5 NL at Foxwoods - very deepstacks - Page 2

Post-Oak · #11 08-01-2005, 02:00 PM

Are you sure he should raise with TT preflop? I heard there are players in that game who will reraise a tight UTG raiser with 49s.

Seriously, TT is not a "definite" raise. In fact, the advice you people are giving him is not logically consistent.

You are basically saying:
1. you need to raise PF with TT to start building a pot
2. people will raise you all-in for many times the pot with semi-bluffs or pure air

Maybe you guys should think about this a little longer.

Furthermore, folding is not ridiculous here, depending on his read of this specific player. The guy is afterall putting in a huge raise compared to the pot.

I agree with you that he should call, but you guys have still given some bad and inconsistent advice/reasoning.

thabadguy · #12 08-01-2005, 02:15 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Are you sure he should raise with TT preflop? I heard there are players in that game who will reraise a tight UTG raiser with 49s.

Seriously, TT is not a "definite" raise. In fact, the advice you people are giving him is not logically consistent.

You are basically saying:
1. you need to raise PF with TT to start building a pot
2. people will raise you all-in for many times the pot with semi-bluffs or pure air

Maybe you guys should think about this a little longer.

Furthermore, folding is not ridiculous here, depending on his read of this specific player. The guy is afterall putting in a huge raise compared to the pot.

I agree with you that he should call, but you guys have still given some bad and inconsistent advice/reasoning.

[/ QUOTE ]
Since he will get semi-bluff raised or even air, isnt that more of a reason to raise TT pf, this hand is a significant fave against a LAG's range of hands.
Please Sit at my game if u fold here with top set!!

Post-Oak · #13 08-01-2005, 02:23 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Since he will get semi-bluff raised or even air, isnt that more of a reason to raise TT pf

[/ QUOTE ]

Uumm, no.

[ QUOTE ]

this hand is a significant fave against a LAG's range of hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

There are guys in the small stakes forum who will be happy to discuss this kind of thinking with you.

thabadguy · #14 08-01-2005, 02:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Since he will get semi-bluff raised or even air, isnt that more of a reason to raise TT pf

[/ QUOTE ]

Uumm, no.

[ QUOTE ]

this hand is a significant fave against a LAG's range of hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

There are guys in the small stakes forum who will be happy to discuss this kind of thinking with you.

[/ QUOTE ]
I dont understand this post at all. Kindly elaborate on your thinking.

Hoopster81 · #15 08-01-2005, 02:28 PM

Does anyone really not instantly call here?

radioheadfan · #16 08-01-2005, 02:31 PM

I'm amazed these sorts of posts get as many replies as they do.

This is an insta-call in the Foxwoods 5-5, with only 1000 behind. Make it 10,000 and then maybe there can be some discussion.

TomCollins · #17 08-01-2005, 02:33 PM

Don't raise preflop.

I expect to see a smaller set way more often than the straight. I also expect to see a flush draw/pair combo more often too.

Call, and yell "pair the board". Simple as that. Then yell "seat open", as you either busted, or you have way too much money for your comfort level at the game.

creedofhubris · #18 08-01-2005, 02:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I was up at Foxwoods for the weekend and decided to try out the 5-5NL game there.
I bought in for the minimun ($500) and ran it up to $1K when this hand came up. With $1K I was still the shortstack at the table. Stack sizes ranged from $1K to $12K.

No real read on Villian in this hand as he just sat down. I did see him show down T7o in a recent hand. So basically he could be playing any 2. But with stacks this deep, that is to be expected anyway I guess.

I pick up TdTc in MP and limp. 3 other limpers.

Flop ($30) - Th 7d 5c

Checked to me, I bet $30, Villain on my immediately left calls, everyone folds.

Turn 4d - I bet $70, Villain raises to $900.

[img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Hero calls.

Hero wins.

turnipmonster · #19 08-01-2005, 02:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Does anyone really not instantly call here?

[/ QUOTE ]

neon · #20 08-01-2005, 02:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Are you sure he should raise with TT preflop? I heard there are players in that game who will reraise a tight UTG raiser with 49s.

Seriously, TT is not a "definite" raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

So you would advocate open-limping in MP w/ 1010? And only raising w/ AA-JJ and AK? Hero may be the shallow stack, but he's still got plenty of room to manuever w/ 200 bb's in front of him. I think not raising here is incredibly weak-tight, and makes for all kinds of uncomfortable situations when the flop comes 8-high, for example, and gives us what amounts to a marginal overpair, which will often be the best hand but that we probably won't feel comfortable playing for our stack with . . .

[ QUOTE ]
You are basically saying:
1. you need to raise PF with TT to start building a pot
2. people will raise you all-in for many times the pot with semi-bluffs or pure air

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you are missing out on some serious value by not raising here. I'm not trying to be a dick, but have you ever played in this game? 'Cause if you're only raising w/ five hands in this game, you're gonna get slaughtered.

[ QUOTE ]
Furthermore, folding is not ridiculous here, depending on his read of this specific player. The guy is afterall putting in a huge raise compared to the pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're right, folding is not ridiculous, especially since it's an unraised pot, and villain very well could have the straight. Yet he could also have a smaller set, two pair, a pair and a flush draw, or a straight draw/flush draw combination. He could also have absolutely nothing. The point is, by buying in for the minimum in this game, where people are routinely sitting down w/ 1000 BBs+++, you might as well hang a sign around your neck that says, "weak-tight nut peddler: raise me at will." If I'm sitting there in that game w/ only a grand in front of me, I feel pretty good about getting my stack in with top set here, and if I lose, then so be it.

And one more thing: if OP had popped it up to $35/$40 or so preflop (standard open for the foxwoods 5-5 game), then the straight would be at least somewhat less of a concern, and hero's hand becomes a bit easier to play, imo.

Just my opinion though, of course.