hand 5 - "How good is your Limit Holdem?"

[Lmn55d]

yea i know, I am just saying that it's important to be careful about analyzing those sorts of situations by looking at a database like that. 100 of each is not nearly enough to have any statistical difference.

[golferbrent]

[ QUOTE ]
In hand 5 in his book "How good is your Limit Holdem?" Jacobs asks this question:

If u are first in on the button, which hand do u prefer:

1) A8o
2) QJo

This was easy for me, but when I looked at the answer he totally disagreed. I was just about to mail him telling him he did a serious misstake but before that I looked in Pokertracker at my last 170K hands to see just how big misstake it was. To my surprise he was right.

Which hand do you prefer?

[/ QUOTE ]

I would prefer Q-Jo much more to A-8 for the reason that when you flop a pair you are more likely to have top pair whereas A-8 is a much more dicey proprosition to play once the flop comes.

I find often when I raise on the button that I am getting called down a lot with any pair hand... therefore in my opinion A-high loses a lot of value. Therefore I would prefer the hand that will flop a top pair good kicker hand that will be paid off often by 2nd pair or 3rd pair.

[ggbman]

When you hit the flop with QJ, hitting either card will usually give you the best hand against a blind, which is true less often than A-8. WHile ace high has showdown value, it's probably not enough to compensate for times you flop very weak hands that you are tempted to show down. ALso, since the blids range of hands is wide, as someone noted, you will will with continuation bets a lot when an ace or King flops anyway.

[ike]

I think its QJo by a good bit. I agree with all the reasons other people have posted but theres one more, IMO pretty big one, no one's mentioned yet: QJ will find itself ahead of a strong second best hand much, much more often than A8 will.

[Jeff W]

I answered that A8o is better for the conditions stated by the book: very aggressive opponent who bluffs and semi bluffs too much.

QJo is better against typical opponents--Aces are bluff outs and you get more action from second best hands when you improve.

[kiddo]

[ QUOTE ]
I answered that A8o is better for the conditions stated by the book: very aggressive opponent who bluffs and semi bluffs too much.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, I didnt state this in my post, but Jacobs says that the guy in Big Blind is aggressive bluffer without being maniac.

You mean A8o works better because u have to see showdown now and then u prefer Ahigh?

[kiddo]

My feeling was that A8o is better because it will win showdown unimproved more often. Only time I would prefer QJo is against a preflopraise from a not very loose player, then I guess QJo is dominated less.

Anyway, Jacobs made me think about this again.

Jacobs says QJo is better then A8o, stealing from button because:

1) If u have a made pair u are in great shape.

2) If one overcard hit its easier to get away.

3) U will more often flop 2 overcards and have 6 outs for toppair instead of 3.

4) U will get paid more, u will get more action on a Q72 flop then a A72 flop.

5) QJo is - mostly because of (2) and (3) - easier to play.

[ike]

[ QUOTE ]
2) If one overcard hit its easier to get away.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is dumb. Shouldn't we all love 23 then?
His other reasons are good. You also get to win more pots without showing down QJo because you more often have enough outs to be able to semibluff.

[fearme]

i think most of u are crazy, id take a8 without even thinking, give me the weak aces!!

[Mikey]

QJ.