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  #1  
Old 12-28-2005, 12:45 AM
Jinx Jinx is offline
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Posts: 101
Default K8s flops middle pair. Raise or call flop?

absolute poker, 10/20 5 handed. Just say down and is new to 10/20 there, so not many reads.

The button raised A9o UTG and rammed and jammed on a AQ9 flop 3 ways. no read on SB. BB is a straight foward table coach, "taggish" stats, but very straight foward.

Converted at PokerGeek
Absolute Limit Hold'em Ring - $10/$20 Stakes (5 handed)

Starting Stacks
Seat 2: Button ($364)
Seat 3: Small blind ($119)
Seat 4: Big blind ($353)
Seat 5: UTG ($972.50)
Seat 6: CO (Hero) ($658)

Preflop: Hero is CO with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero raises, Button calls, Small blind calls, Big blind calls

Flop: (7.50 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
Small blind bets, Big blind calls, Hero...

Is this a raise or a call?
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  #2  
Old 12-28-2005, 12:51 AM
Alobar Alobar is offline
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Default Re: K8s flops middle pair. Raise or call flop?

The dryness of the flop kinda scares me, but I think I still like a raise over a call, you can lose the button and act last on ther turn were you have several options of how to continue.
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  #3  
Old 12-28-2005, 01:21 AM
StellarWind StellarWind is offline
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Default Re: K8s flops middle pair. Raise or call flop?

Interesting problem and I could see doing it either way.

This is a pretty dry flop except for gutshots. It disturbs me that SB would lead 4-handed and a TAG calls from second seat.

My vote is to call, see an important card, and then figure out what to do:

1. SB is unlikely to lead again with junk into several callers. I'll have a better idea about him after I see his turn action.

2. Straight forward TAG will tell me the truth about his hand. If he's got something he'll make his move on the turn whether SB bets or not.

3. Based on your one-hand read Button is apt to react immediately if the flop has hit him. Anyway his flop action will certainly give me a better idea whether he is going to be a problem.

A side benefit of calling is everyone is apt to misread me for overcards.

The bombs away raise approach is also viable and could pay dividends in protecting your hand. But it probably commits you to investing more money than this hand may be worth. Another overcard to the eight would not be pretty.
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  #4  
Old 12-28-2005, 02:55 AM
Jinx Jinx is offline
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Default Re: K8s flops middle pair. Raise or call flop?

Thanks for the rally well thought out reply. I really have to start thinking about hands this deeply~
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  #5  
Old 12-28-2005, 05:29 AM
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Default Re: K8s flops middle pair. Raise or call flop?

Isn't this a pretty clear reverse-implied odds hand?
I am pretty LAGgy and I may fold here.

Otherwise I might find a raise with the backdoor flush draw.
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  #6  
Old 12-28-2005, 01:08 PM
Alobar Alobar is offline
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Default Re: K8s flops middle pair. Raise or call flop?

[ QUOTE ]
Isn't this a pretty clear reverse-implied odds hand?
I am pretty LAGgy and I may fold here.

Otherwise I might find a raise with the backdoor flush draw.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this would be a pretty awful fold getting 8-1
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  #7  
Old 12-28-2005, 03:17 PM
AviD AviD is offline
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Default Re: K8s flops middle pair. Raise or call flop?

[ QUOTE ]
Interesting problem and I could see doing it either way.

This is a pretty dry flop except for gutshots. It disturbs me that SB would lead 4-handed and a TAG calls from second seat.

My vote is to call, see an important card, and then figure out what to do:

1. SB is unlikely to lead again with junk into several callers. I'll have a better idea about him after I see his turn action.

2. Straight forward TAG will tell me the truth about his hand. If he's got something he'll make his move on the turn whether SB bets or not.

3. Based on your one-hand read Button is apt to react immediately if the flop has hit him. Anyway his flop action will certainly give me a better idea whether he is going to be a problem.

A side benefit of calling is everyone is apt to misread me for overcards.

The bombs away raise approach is also viable and could pay dividends in protecting your hand. But it probably commits you to investing more money than this hand may be worth. Another overcard to the eight would not be pretty.

[/ QUOTE ]

I like all of this.
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