2/4 KTs

[Nick Royale]

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Well be dominated? WTF are you talking about? People have called not raied, they don't have KJ KQ AK.

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I agree, if the limpers are loose we shouldn't worry too much of the limpers, but there are certainly many players at 2/4 that will limp these hands fom EP.

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We can't be scared of people who haven't acted yet, or people who MIGHT coldcall.

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There's a ~26% chance someone behind holds AA-TT/AK/KQ-KJ/AT. I don't expect these to fold to a raise, often we'll get 3-betted. And there's an additional ~12% chance somebody
holds AQ/AJ. I think there's too many players left to act to raise.

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If people coldcall behind us our K might not be good but our T is awesome and our spades kick ass.

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Raise and getting cold cold by AK/KQ/KJ/AT kicks ass? It kicks your ass my friend.

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Besides, if we coldcall then we let retard A4 hands or some [censored] in and potentially cost us the pot.

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You're telling me you fear someone limping in with this crap? We have a great multiway hand and they don't, we like [censored] like A4 limping when we're getting us a very multiway hand. We LOVE players limping with crap! Why wouldn't we like players with poor equity to limp?

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Seriosuly folding here sucks but calling here is way way worse than raising. IMO NOT raising here is a large mistake.

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This decision is close, saying otherwise is silly imo.

[Nick Royale]

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We can't be scared of people who haven't acted yet, or people who MIGHT coldcall.

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Ok, so you don't play position? You don't change your raising standards when everybody has fold to you in MP3? I think you do and the reason is that there's less players left to act...

[istewart]

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Seriosuly folding here sucks but calling here is way way worse than raising. IMO NOT raising here is a large mistake.

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How can this possibly be true? You're raising K9s here? And 100% of the time?

[goofball]

I am. how the hell can you not raise here? K9s is a raise. Good god how can it not be. K9s is a raise. KTs is a raise, You just ahve way way too much hand to not be raising here.

[goofball]

also - nick royale - A4o is NOT crap(as far as we're concerned). We're behiind A4o as it stands and folding that hand helps us.

[Nick Royale]

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also - nick royale - A4o is NOT crap(as far as we're concerned). We're behiind A4o as it stands and folding that hand helps us.

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In the multiway pot I was talking about A4o is crap and total garbage. I can agree we don't want an A against us if we're planning to get it shorthanded like you though. I can also agree that we would prefer not having an ace against us in a multiway pot as well, but that's not such a big concern as you seem to want to make it, and if it's along with a 4 kicker unsuited it's even less a concern. A4o will have a very low equity in a multiway pot.

[Pharity]

No. There is a big difference between heads up and multiway. A4o is ahead of us heads up, but multiway it's real Crap. Run some sims in pokerstove and you'll see. We want it to limp because it doesn't have an equity edge in this spot, but we do.

[hobbsmann]

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I am. how the hell can you not raise here? K9s is a raise. Good god how can it not be. K9s is a raise. KTs is a raise, You just ahve way way too much hand to not be raising here.

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I agree with and everything else goofball has said in this thread.

This is just a ton of back & forth about a decision that can't possibily be worth that much in overall EV. Is this whole post a PF call/raise decision, or is there a hand coming?

[Nick Royale]

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This is just a ton of back & forth about a decision that can't possibily be worth that much in overall EV. Is this whole post a PF call/raise decision, or is there a hand coming?

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From the beginning this was a "I flopped a roayle flush, could I have extracted more from it"-thread, but jason re-posted the only interesting part of it. So no, there's nothing more coming. But according to some there's a huge differance in EV between raising and calling, I agree with you, it's only very slim.