WPT Atlantis Satellite hand, Made flush and board pairs...... - Page 2

rockythecat99 · #11 10-31-2005, 11:13 AM

I didn't raise him because I wanted him to think I had the ace of diamonds and stay with me. I thought a raise was definitely going to make him fold here even two pair as the table was super tight.

I called. River came a nasty little 8. He shoved. My move???

1800GAMBLER · #12 10-31-2005, 11:56 AM

I fold. He doesn't care about free cards at all. It's a confident line. 87 makes most sense.

I would have raised the flop.

#13 10-31-2005, 12:02 PM

Fold and curse yourself for not raising the flop - reckon he has a 7 and just filled up

rockythecat99 · #14 10-31-2005, 12:07 PM

K I want to see how wrong my thinking is so please tell me.

My flat call of the flop bet was because I didn't want him going anywhere. The table had been tight enough that I was very certain he would fold to any raise. If I flat call I thought I could represent a dry ace of diamonds trying to catch my flush. Is this really that bad?? I mean everyone here is advocating a flop raise and I am starting to think my line is horrible. But please explain to me your thought process.

Is it really worth raising here when you will win a little pot?? Strass I would really like your input on this as you are one of the ones who advocated a flop raise.

centja1 · #15 10-31-2005, 12:21 PM

well, part of the rationale for not raising the flop is that you have the nuts and are a solid favorite to have the nuts when all of the cards are out and you'd like to build a bigger pot since there was no real money put in before the flop.

the flip side of this is that the pot is still relatively small now that you don't have the nuts, so the possibility that you just got outdrawn is not that big a tragedy.

Playing your hand in this manner implies that you should also be able to get away from it when you get the impression you are beaten (which villain is certainly telling you here).

That said, I think it's 50/50 that he has a boat here. One read that might tip our decision towards raising or folding here is how villain perceives you. Have you been playing LAG or TAG? Can he rely on you to bet when he checks or are you going to check behind if you have the bare A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]?

The answer to this question will have a major impact on how we proceed, because if he can't rely on you to bet, the logical conclusion is that he isn't really all that concerned about free cards here and his range of hands would then favor having a boat as opposed to top pair.

rockythecat99 · #16 10-31-2005, 12:29 PM

[ QUOTE ]
well, part of the rationale for not raising the flop is that you have the nuts and are a solid favorite to have the nuts when all of the cards are out and you'd like to build a bigger pot since there was no real money put in before the flop.

the flip side of this is that the pot is still relatively small now that you don't have the nuts, so the possibility that you just got outdrawn is not that big a tragedy.

Playing your hand in this manner implies that you should also be able to get away from it when you get the impression you are beaten (which villain is certainly telling you here).

That said, I think it's 50/50 that he has a boat here. One read that might tip our decision towards raising or folding here is how villain perceives you. Have you been playing LAG or TAG? Can he rely on you to bet when he checks or are you going to check behind if you have the bare A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]?

The answer to this question will have a major impact on how we proceed, because if he can't rely on you to bet, the logical conclusion is that he isn't really all that concerned about free cards here and his range of hands would then favor having a boat as opposed to top pair.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok to answer your questions. I have been playing pretty tightly for my standards. I think he perceives me as tight having said that. I think the way I played it to the turn screams me trying to steal this hand with the bare Ad. I really thought that he would just fold or flat call my turn bet. When he reraised me I was pretty surprised.

rockythecat99 · #17 10-31-2005, 05:20 PM

bump because I want an explanation why to raise the flop. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Yeti · #18 10-31-2005, 05:31 PM

[ QUOTE ]
bump because I want an explanation why to raise the flop. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

You have a good hand. You want to win a big pot. You don't want another diamond coming and killing your action. Or worse, the board pairing, and causing you to lose.

He has a hand or he doesnt. Let's find out and play ball.

rockythecat99 · #19 10-31-2005, 05:32 PM

Hehe thanks. But if I want to win a big pot. Raising is just going to chase away a tight player with nothing isn't it? I am sorry if I am being redundant.

Yeti · #20 10-31-2005, 05:35 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Raising is just going to chase away a tight player with nothing isn't it?

[/ QUOTE ]

So you think if you allow him to improve to a decent hand, say, 2pr, a 'tight player' is going to pay you off massively on a monotone board with a straight possible?