Should I see a gynecologist?

cartman · #1 07-14-2005, 06:15 PM

Let's assume villain is a 45/10 unknown. I would feel like a moron calling down with these, but I feel like I need to see a gynecologist when I fold. If I know the opponent, I am not so lost, but for the sake of this question lets call him "unknown" or "typical". This is in a 5/10 context, but I would very much appreciate answers or contrasts from 10/20 and higher also.

Hand #1
PREFLOP: UTG+1 limps, everyone folds, Hero checks in the BB with T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].

FLOP: J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Hero bets, UTG+1 raises, Hero calls.

TURN: 5 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets, Hero folds.

__________________________________________________ __________

Hand #2
PREFLOP: UTG+1 limps, everyone folds, Hero checks in the BB with T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].

FLOP: K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Hero bets, UTG+1 raises, Hero calls.

TURN: 5 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets, Hero folds.

__________________________________________________ __________

Hand #3
PREFLOP: UTG+1 limps, everyone folds, Hero checks in the BB with T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].

FLOP: K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Hero bets, UTG+1 calls.

TURN: 5 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Hero bets, UTG+1 raises, Hero folds.

__________________________________________________ ___________

What would you guys have done differently?

Thanks,
Cartman

#2 07-14-2005, 07:33 PM

Hand 2 and 3 are identical, probably not what you meant.

Hande 1 seems pretty standard to me. Hand 2 is read dependent. Sometimes I'll 3 bet, call a cap and fold the turn UI. If he calls the 3-bet I lead the turn and river and fold to a raise UI.

Not sure that's the best line, but I don't like surrendering 2nd pair HU.

Monty Cantsin · #3 07-14-2005, 07:36 PM

I think folding hand 1 is fine.

I call down in hand 2, mostly because I have a stronger hand. In hand 1 you can only beat a pure bluff or a draw that misses. In hand 2 you can beat a pure bluff, a draw that misses, a weaker ten, a 2, and a small pocket pair.

As a side note, I find the whole passive = weak = woman thing creepy, dumb, and, frankly, bad poker.

/mc

marand · #4 07-14-2005, 07:38 PM

I would have played it the same. Against some opponents I would call down with 2nd pair. I would be more inclined to call down at 10/20 than 5/10 since the "average opponent" is more aggressive. With 2nd pair good kicker I would take far more hands to SD than with middle pair no kicker.

cartman · #5 07-14-2005, 09:20 PM

I did mean for #2 and #3 to have the identical cards. In hand #2 he raised the flop and in hand #3 he raised the turn. Thanks for your comments.

cartman · #6 07-14-2005, 09:21 PM

[ QUOTE ]

As a side note, I find the whole passive = weak = woman thing creepy, dumb, and, frankly, bad poker.

/mc

[/ QUOTE ]

I apologize for offending you or anyone else.

Digs · #7 07-14-2005, 09:31 PM

I like to play 2 and 3 a little more aggro on the flop and go for a c/r. It helps me get better info for later streets.

1 I just get rid of when the pot gets breathed on really.

Am I the only one taking these lines? Being noob sucks :P

Alyssa · #8 07-14-2005, 09:52 PM

Hand #1 is an easy fold.

Hand #2 is read dependant. Against an unknown you should fold. But don't 3-bet. You're either way behind or a bit ahead.

Monty Cantsin · #9 07-14-2005, 10:45 PM

[ QUOTE ]

I apologize for offending you or anyone else.

[/ QUOTE ]

No biggy. I know it's common slang around here to equate weak/tight with female. It's always bothered me, and I just picked on you because your title made it weirdly explicit.

I, too, thought hand 3 was a typo. Looking at it again, I think my default play would be to not fold to the turn raise. Just because I feel like I'm ahead here enough of the time against typical players.

There's a lot of conflicting stuff going on in this hand - turn raises are usually bigger deals than flop raises, the pot size is small so you should be less likely to call down, the turn didn't bring any obvious draws for him to be semi-bluffing, these are all reasons to fold.

But you have a reasonably solid pair heads up in a short-handed game against an unknown opponent and that's a good reason not to fold. I'm guilty of extremely lazy poker and in this case I'm letting the rule of thumb "don't fold a pair heads up" play the hand for me.

/mc

Stack · #10 07-15-2005, 06:42 AM

I see a showdown in hand# 2 only. I fold the other two.

I might be weak too, but in hand one I really don't have a hand and any card is an overcard for me. With position it is different.

In hand# 3, I do feel weak vs turn raises. I'm not sure if folding is the best play but there is no draw for him to semibluff with a worse hand than yours. I fold it here with no reads.