i thought i played this right but ....... now im not so sure

[knifeandfork]

1 oclock daily at the alladin our fine gentleman and fellow 2+2er ACJR is providing some inspriational sweat for me so im confident. the bubble has just burst so we are down to 6 the blinds are 1k2k and go up every 20 minutes doubling. ladder is approx 130 175 225 300 425 600. no deal has been discussed. im utg when this hand comes up and the seats are
seat 1 sb in this hand the clear chip lead wild man that limps or raises to vary his play plays a few too many hands and would be really good except for a penchant to get too aggressive, chase or play decent hands at the wrong time or for the wrong amount basically a decently skilled gambler. im cautious around him and he knows this ~25k
seat 2 the short stack a young guy who seems pretty patient and willing to wait his way up the ladder or for his monster the bb in the hand is him but he has shown already he is not afraid to fold his blinds and just tripled up to about 7k after posting
seat 3 village idiot with about 18.5 k (me) 2nd in chips barely
seat 4 local wants to play good pretty readable probably cant fold much of a hand once he is in pot at all but cautious none the less 9k
seat 5
seat 4s friend and they make no illusions otherwise have to be warned later when 4 tells 5 to "find a better spot" basically a slightly weaker version of his friend a little less selective with his hands a little more callly station like 7.5k
seat 6 is the best player at the table and the button in this hand. jose i think it was he was at my first table to my left and we both actually hoped for the table to break thankfully it did. jose seems genuinely skilled at nlhe tournament play and although i feel i have an idea of where he is at when he raises i think he is the only player signifigantly more experienced than myself he has 18k one chip less than my self.

UTG (18.5k) blinds 1k2k is dealt JhJd
take it away experts will provide my decisions and results in a later post. thanks in advance and be specific please . this may be where the subtlety lies....
village idiot,
jason

[ZootMurph]

- What has been the average preflop open raise at the table?
- Is it generally released to the preflop raiser, or are most raised pots contested?
- If you raise the 'usual amount', what hands do you think will call you?
- Are there no antes?

The individual reads are great, but without a read of how the play has been in general, it's hard to say what is best.

With nothing known about the general table play and reactions to preflop raises, and no antes, I'd say to come with a bet of 4500. This bet will basically pot commit the three smaller stacks if they want to play, leaving the button and SB. Button probably won't play without at least two bigger cards, and will reraise with a bigger pair, so he should be easy to figure. If one of the 3 small go all in, you will have to call, but will still have half your stack left if you lose the race. That leaves SB. If he calls you, you'll have to push on a flop that gives you 3 unders, and try to check/raise him on a Jack. Any overs, you'll have to check through or fold.

[knifeandfork]

basically there hasnt been a standard raise established really. great question there have been a few limps (mostly from the sb with the big stack) most other bets in the last round have been pushes or huge equivalents. no antes. 70 or more percent have been let go to the raiser but the bubble just burst within the last 2 or was it 3 hands so that changes a lot of course. i like your idea of the 4500 raise. i think the button will respect my raise and fold everything sans or maybe including AK, TT and reraise bigger pairs he might get tricky with me but i doubt it considering the small blinds tendencies, and the alarm bells that would go off if he flat called. the small blind may come over the top of me with a worse hand and put me to a tough decision considering some hands he has shown down.otherwise i think i agree on the play given him calling. thanks for the great response id like to hear a few more but my actions thoughts and the results to follow.
jason

[theantelope]

What's so wrong with pushing here?

[ninjaunderwear]

Don't think pushing while 2nd in chips and UTG is the right choice here. Considering the types of hands that would call your UTG all-in, you're at best a coin-flip and at worst drawing to two.

With the bubble freshly burst, several weaker players with only a few rounds left in them, and a decent chance of taking down the big one, it's not a good time to risk ALL your chips to win blind money.

2.5x-3.5x BB seems not too small, not too big, but just right. Likely that everyone folds or a short stack pushes. If it gets to a flop, you're still in a good position with a made hand.

[knifeandfork]

i rased to 7k (3.5BB) utg+1 went all in in a shot folded back to me i call the 2k more and he has QQ. would could the results have been different if i raised to 5 k? i probably stillwouldnt fold but i might have, considering i was nearpositive wehn he made that push i was beat. in this instance iwas commited if he showed me aces i still call 2000 in to a 19k pot. i can fold though perhaps for 4k in to 17k pot. just thought it was interesting how much difference the one bb made. imho. carried the torch on to a respectable 4th place
jason

[zaxx19]

I dont think you could have gotten away from JJ here against a guy with 3.5BB...it may sound trite but THATS POKER. I like coming in for 4.5k personally makes it a little less painless if worse case scenario occurs- push and a push by the big stack....or even someone else, as I really dont wanna play JJ 3 ways if I can get busted here.

[woodguy]

[ QUOTE ]
Considering the types of hands that would call your UTG all-in, you're at best a coin-flip and at worst drawing to two.


[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree.

The short stacks are going to look him up with any A, so unless its AK or AQ, they will be drawing to 3 outs.

They will also look you up with any pair, most which you dominate.

With 9.5BB's and JJ UTG you push, if you run into QQ-AA, you were cold decked and were going broke anyway. Cards happen.

If you get called by a lower pair, Ax (including AK&AQ), that is good. Your stack is short, your hand is good, push.

PokerStove#'s against probably calling hands:

JJ vs. AA-55,AKs-A6s,AKo-A6o,KQ

JJ=64%
range=36%

Its not really close.

Regards,
Woodguy

[knifeandfork]

thanks to both of you for taking the time to reply. he had 4.5 bb btw zaxx. wood im normally with you on pushing here but wehn 9.5 bb is second in chips and i got a strong player, a wild decent player and 4 unknowns behind me i want to be able to fold if one of the guyys that can bust me or essentially bust me wakes up with aces,kings,queens. only one guy at the table i could easily fold jacks to but if i went 5 instead of 7 i might have been able to fold based on read is all. I think im being results oriented and trying to play in a utopia here but... thanks guys for replying.
jason