67s on the button, 8 to the flop, i flop top pair

[jacki]

<font color="blue"> I hate the flop bet in retrospect. Anyone see a turn fold or a river bet? </font>


Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is Button with 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. CO posts a blind of $2.
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, CO (poster) checks, Hero calls, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (8 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(8 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, MP2 checks, MP3 checks, CO checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, SB folds, BB calls, <font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, UTG+1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO folds, Hero calls, BB calls.

Turn: (8 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, MP3 calls, Hero calls, BB calls.

River: (12 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG checks, MP3 checks, Hero checks.

Final Pot: 12 BB

[ebranig]

The flop bet is correct and necessary, so is the flop call.

The turn call is also a no-brainer (you've got a gutshot and your 7 outs are good).

The river is iffy, if it is a VB then it is very thin.

[Rudbaeck]

[ QUOTE ]
The flop bet is correct and necessary, so is the flop call.

[/ QUOTE ]

I understand that the call is automatic when it's check/raised, but I take exception to the bet being obviously correct.

This bet does nothing to defend our hand. Anyone with any hint of a draw, even two overcards, is correct to call.

The bet does nothing to protect our hand, our equity will change dramatically on the turn, either up or down. I see this is a pretty clear check actually.

[crunchy1]

[ QUOTE ]
This bet does nothing to defend our hand. Anyone with any hint of a draw, even two overcards, is correct to call.

[/ QUOTE ]
When overcard hands fold to our flop bet - we gain A LOT! (Not to mention that we easily have enough equity on the flop to put a bet in and grow the pot a little)

[Rudbaeck]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This bet does nothing to defend our hand. Anyone with any hint of a draw, even two overcards, is correct to call.

[/ QUOTE ]
When overcard hands fold to our flop bet - we gain A LOT! (Not to mention that we easily have enough equity on the flop to put a bet in and grow the pot a little)

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, hoping that big fields of small stakes fish all will make incorrect lay downs is stretching it a bit.

This hand is similar to the TT example in 'Two Overpair Hands' in SSH. I'll happily claim that Ed would agree to wait for the turn. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[Entity]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This bet does nothing to defend our hand. Anyone with any hint of a draw, even two overcards, is correct to call.

[/ QUOTE ]
When overcard hands fold to our flop bet - we gain A LOT! (Not to mention that we easily have enough equity on the flop to put a bet in and grow the pot a little)

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, hoping that big fields of small stakes fish all will make incorrect lay downs is stretching it a bit.

This hand is similar to the TT example in 'Two Overpair Hands' in SSH. I'll happily claim that Ed would agree to wait for the turn. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

The hands aren't similar at all and you'd be pretty wrong to hope that Ed would agree that checking the flop in an 8SB pot when no one has shown any interest and you have a fair amount of equity.

The conversation of offering infinite odds vs. offering limited odds has been covered before. In addition, your gutshot adds to your potential equity in this hand.

This is an easy flop bet.

Rob

[mack848]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This bet does nothing to defend our hand. Anyone with any hint of a draw, even two overcards, is correct to call.

[/ QUOTE ]
When overcard hands fold to our flop bet - we gain A LOT! (Not to mention that we easily have enough equity on the flop to put a bet in and grow the pot a little)

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, hoping that big fields of small stakes fish all will make incorrect lay downs is stretching it a bit.

[/ QUOTE ]

It is potentially a coup if 2 or 3 opponents fold overcards. If the turn is a J, you'll be happy that JT folded.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This bet does nothing to defend our hand. Anyone with any hint of a draw, even two overcards, is correct to call.

[/ QUOTE ]
When overcard hands fold to our flop bet - we gain A LOT! (Not to mention that we easily have enough equity on the flop to put a bet in and grow the pot a little)

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, hoping that big fields of small stakes fish all will make incorrect lay downs is stretching it a bit.

This hand is similar to the TT example in 'Two Overpair Hands' in SSH. I'll happily claim that Ed would agree to wait for the turn. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the difference between this hand and Ed's TT example is that we have more redraws to improve here. I don't see the flop bet as a protection bet, I see it as a value bet - we have 7-9 outs to get better here.

I think we should pop the turn but I am in the "over aggro" stage of my transformation from weak-tightie to 2+2er LOL. I agree with the consensus check down on the river.

[TheHip41]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The flop bet is correct and necessary, so is the flop call.

[/ QUOTE ]

I understand that the call is automatic when it's check/raised, but I take exception to the bet being obviously correct.

This bet does nothing to defend our hand. Anyone with any hint of a draw, even two overcards, is correct to call.

The bet does nothing to protect our hand, our equity will change dramatically on the turn, either up or down. I see this is a pretty clear check actually.

[/ QUOTE ]


I think alot of hands will fold to a flop bet. If someone limped in with K9o, they might fold, if someone has 22, they might fold.

As the hand went, I'm checking the river, seeing as you are losing to everything he would c/r the flop with except hands like A3. If he has a 5 or a 7, or 88, you lose

[Nick Royale]

Perfect.
No need to hate the flop bet, it's easy.
Absolutely no way to fold anywhere.
And I don't think you can bet the river for value.