PLO/8 hand

Swede · #1 01-13-2005, 02:26 PM

Hello all! This is a hand I played just a few hours ago and I´d like to hear what you think. Please keep in mind that I´m totally new to PLO/8, just started playing it a few days ago. This is also my 1st hand post so let me know if I did anything wrong.

Party Poker Pot-Limit Omaha/8, $2 BB (10 handed) converter

saw flop|saw showdown

UTG+1 ($93)
Hero ($180.2)
MP1 ($96)
MP2 ($74)
MP3 ($232.15)
CO ($100)
Button ($82.65)
SB ($206.28)
BB ($63.35)
UTG ($272.35)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls $2, UTG+1 folds, Hero calls $2, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO raises to $11, Button folds, SB calls $10, BB calls $9, UTG calls $9, Hero calls $9.

Is it ok to call this PFR?

Flop: ($55) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB bets $52.25, BB raises to $52.35 (All-In), UTG folds, Hero raises to $104.6, CO folds, SB raises to $195.28 (All-In), Hero calls $64.60 (All-In).

This is a good flop for me. I was thinking about flat-calling here(perhaps I should have?) At this point I was sure SB was on a flush draw + something like Jx 10x. Had I just called here I would have had to fold to a bet if a [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] fell on the turn, right?

Turn: ($471.83) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players, 3 all-in)

River: ($471.83) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players, 3 all-in)

Final Pot: $471.83
Main Pot: $212.05, between Hero, SB and BB.
Pot 2: $233.70, between Hero and SB.
Pot 3: $26.08, returned to SB.

Results to follow. All comments greatly appreciated. I find PLO/8 to be a fascinating game and am determined to learn how to play it properly. Is it possible to grasp the concepts of PLO/8 having only played very little OH/PLO?

Best, John

BradleyT · #2 01-13-2005, 02:58 PM

I'd probably fold preflop - this isn't holdem and you've got crappy position. There's no way you should call a raise preflop.

On the flop getting your stack all in is fine with top set. Villian probably has A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]xx

Cleveland Guy · #3 01-13-2005, 03:18 PM

Okay - I'll give it ago. You might get better feedback in the PLO section, it's both for hi and hi/lo.

Preflop - your limp from EP is okay, but I think I am throwing away to a raise. You have no low, and a pair of kings. Your flush draw is good, but in O/8 will get you in trouble, as hands like a3sxx - that are a throw away in high only are very playable in hi/lo.

About the only thing you can hope for on this flop is a King with no low and no made straight or flush.

The Flop - You got it. You got the King, you got the set, there is a straight draw AND a flush draw. On the good news there is no good low draw, it would have to come runner runner.

Flat calling would be wrong. The min raise was wrong. At this point you have the best hand - but other than a full house, no re-draws.

You obviously can't get the all in player to fold, but at this time I would try and isolate him. A guy opening with a pot sized bet isn't going to fold to a min-raise here.

You should have re-raised all in on that flop. Isolate the other all in player, I'd rather play top set with no re-draws vs. one player than vs. 2.

kenberman · #4 01-13-2005, 03:19 PM

Hi Swede,
I'm a novice PLO8 player as well. That said, I don't think there is anyway you can make this pre-flop call, and this hand is why:

Your flop is almost ideal, yet is still very vulnerable to other players.

(my name it is) Sam Hall · #5 01-13-2005, 04:20 PM

[ QUOTE ]
This is a good flop for me. I was thinking about flat-calling here(perhaps I should have?)

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the SB was exploiting a hole in PP's rules. He bet a miniscule amount less than BB stack, hoping BB would raise him the extra $0.10 all-in for the sake of neatness. Supposing you then call, he can re-raise you all-in. This gives him a much better chance of getting all your money assuming he has the hand to do it. You threw him a curve by raising, but it didn't slow him down at all. I don't think raising an all-in where it is less than the min bet to call is usually allowed elsewhere. Is this right and/or make any sense?

Fold this hand preflop, or attempt to limp in and fold to the raise. You have a marginal high hand and no low. I'm guessing SB had a monster draw after the flop. You had top set, but he had A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]QQ or A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]2JT [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]?

Sam

bigredlemon · #6 01-14-2005, 01:32 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This is a good flop for me. I was thinking about flat-calling here(perhaps I should have?)

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the SB was exploiting a hole in PP's rules. He bet a miniscule amount less than BB stack, hoping BB would raise him the extra $0.10 all-in for the sake of neatness. Supposing you then call, he can re-raise you all-in.
Sam

[/ QUOTE ]PP doesn't allow that. He only has the option of calling the extra 10 cents if no one else raises.

bigredlemon · #7 01-14-2005, 01:34 AM

keep in mind that in Omaha, draws can be favourites against the current made hand.

If there is a flush possibility, chances are someone has it. Looks like you got sucked out on but what can you do eh.

TylerD · #8 01-14-2005, 07:48 AM

You have to fold this to a raise preflop. You are basically looking to hit your set cheaply as the rest of the hand is junk and you are out of position. When the raise comes back to , you should fold.

gergery · #9 01-14-2005, 09:31 AM

easy fold from EP for me. there are not many flops you like enough to want to jam.

Swede · #10 01-14-2005, 09:57 AM

Thank you for the response. It´s now obvious that I should have folded pre-flop. It´s also painfully obvious that I have a lot to learn about starting hands.

FWIW, SB showed T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] for the win. Guess his was a worse hand than mine. He led out with a pot-sized bet drawing to a non-nut flush and an inside straight. Oh well, at least I´m having fun!

Best, John