Confessions of a mediocre tournament player

[MikeSmith]

I have gone through this exact same mentality for years in the tournaments. After the first break of a tourney when im 5x the average stack and after the third break everyone caught up. Now i feel the need i have to go outside of my usual game and make stupid moves with marginal hands just so i can have that "above average feeling".

First off, i now ignore how everyone else in chips is doing(i ll pay attention to their stacks at the FT but thats it), i cant control their stacks, i can only control my own and i will not change my game just because they doubled up to close to my stack. I mainly look at how my stack is relative to the blinds and i will change my game when i feel that the blinds are requiring me to do so. I have put myself in the same marginal situation that you have described time and again. We make plays that are outside of our abilities or are simply unnecessary or just dumb plays.

In the situation you were in i would have folded and say to myself "I ll pick a better spot". As in a situation where i start out as the aggressor and/or have a premium hand or good draw.

[ZootMurph]

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Preflop: Hero is BB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
7 folds, SB raises to t3600,


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Against a hyperaggressive player, I'm reraising preflop to put him to the test, not after the flop where almost any two cards beat me. I'll put him to the test by making it 1/3 of his stack, or 10800 to go. I'd fold to an allin reraise, still having over 30k chips to work with. If he calls that large reraise, I'm done with the hand unless I flop something REALLY nice. With 30k chips left, I'm not exactly happy to give up a big pot, but I'm also very happy to be able to continue playing in the tournament with a decent chip stack in relation to the blinds.

[Annulus]

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I can relate to alot of what you are saying. I like Adanthars line also. One thing that has helped me alot lately is giving up on a hand. I will take a stab just like you did here on the flop (smaller bet tho) and after he calls I will give up. Don't get discouraged because you lost some chips. This is part of poker, you can't win every pot. Keep fancy plays to a minimum at the low buy-in tourneys. Good luck.

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There is a problem if you do this all the time(bet the flop and give up). A smarter player is going to pick up on this and pull a 'call bluff' on you.

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I meant more in this example.

[HoldingFolding]

Love your work McMelchior, love your work. I was just about to make a post containing this line [ QUOTE ]
most of my tournament's end when I hand over a large part of my stack to an opponent during failed bluff attempts.

[/ QUOTE ] , but I think my selective memory may be kicking in because I also tend to build my stack with bluffs too.

Care to elaborate on the "dark tunnel bluff" concept?

As an aside your hand reminds me of this one of mine in the STT forum which is currently taking a lot of abuse.

[nath]

Too much thinking. Listen to your instincts.

Reraise preflop if you think he's weak. Make the move when the move is to be made; he who hesitates is lost.

Dark Tunnel Bluff is from Harrington on Hold 'Em Vol 2.

"...reminds me of how many beginners and intermediate players approach poker hands. They find themselves making bets which aren't really bluffs, but aren't really value bets either. They're just - bets. I call these "Dark Tunnel" bluffs. You don't know where you stand, you dont know really what you're doing, but it feels more active to bet than not, so you put more money in the pot. Eventually you've lost a big pot where you never really had much of a chance."

I think the solution to your problem is on this very same page.

Quoting the master of masters:

"Always know why you are making a bet, and what you expect to gain. Every good bet should either give you a chance to win the pot right there, or provide you with information about your opponent's cards thta you can act on through the rest of the hand."

Just remember that everytime you're thinking about betting. Don't hope, reason it out and know why you're betting and what you're going to do if you get called/raised etc.

What I like to do is take a bit of time if I get called or raised. A little hesitation might cause you to see the situation better and save you chips.

[ajizzle]

I had the same problem as you did for a long time. Within the last month however, I have opened up my game a little and it has worked wonders to my results. A little luck doesnt hurt either.

But on to the point, the first thing i did to open up was punish limpers. I think this is more important that stealing blinds or protecting your blind. When in LP and in the 2nd+ hour, if i have a healthy stack, I punish the limpers. If in LP, I will raise to 4x about 80% of the time when there is 1 limper, to 5-6x about 60% of the time with 2 limpers. In MP, about 50% of the time to 4x when there is one limper. Also, I try to raise to 5x from the sb when there is EP-MP limper, and 5.5x if there is one EP and one LP limper. There's more to it than just randomly choosing when to make these steals. Try to do it against players that have slightly lower stacks than yours. If they are low, they will push more often, if they are big, they will call and try to outflop/outplay you. Note: I try not do this too much from the BB with air, cuz anyone who has read/heard of TPFAF will instinctively think you are stealing.


As a side note, you can't be afraid to make a healthy continuation bet on the flop when you miss completely. If you can't do this, you are just throwing chips away. The PF steal works about 60% of the time, but the flop bets works another 75%, so it is very important to keep the pressure up. Finally, you can't get attached to a hand if you catch some of the flop. I recently busted out late in a tourney when i raised a limper with 96s and flopped top pair on a 977 flop. He didnt release his TT and by then end of the hand, i was crippled. Although this will happen sometimes, you must be willing to make the continuation bet on the flop. Just remember though, unless a scare card hits the turn, or you have some read that tells you he will fold on the turn, dont expect an out of position player to release a hand after calling a raise before the flop, and a healthy bet on the flop.

[CardSharpCook]

One of the poker truisms I've come across is that when a player checks when you expect him to bet, it usually menas he just made his hand and has been excited into inaction.

[JustPlayingSmart]

You bet too much on the flop. There is no need to bet more than the pot here. If I was to bet I would bet around 4500. I would bet 4500 with any hand I planned on betting here, so while I may have a bluff, I may also have a strong hand. The river bluff depends on the type of $5 rebuy player you are against. If you are against a guy who calls because he has QJ and 2 pair here, then it fails. But you may also be against a weak tight guy who will fold because he thinks a straight is highly likely from you. You said that part of your strength is in your preflop reads, so maybe you have some sense of this player's category.

The other thing is that you have a very healthy stack for this stage of a $5 rebuy, and I don't think you "have to" make any moves right now. I'm not saying that you shouldn't make any moves, but you have enough chips that you could miss out on a couple steals and still be fine.

I would say that most of the big scores of posters on this forum have resulted from making aggressive plays that put them in bad spots and then sucking out. They continue to make those plays because a lot of the time they steal rather large pots with minimal risk.

[BCl]

I cant believe with all the info and great insight from great players ive gotten on this site that the 1st thing that came to my mind when i read how this hand was played came right out of Brunsons Super System....Get aggressive when you HAVE AN OUT....you had no out at all.
As a pretty regular $5 dollar player however ill offer this insight, most guys who hit this flop hard are all-in right then...the fact that he called your bet tells me hes got at least a piece if not the nuts and is perfectly willing to let you lead with all the chips you want to put in...maybe he's drawing as well but id be willing to bet he's already got a nice chunk of this flop and your not being all-in tells him your not sure your piece is bigger than his.
I'm in the same boat you are i assure you, im so tired of 25th- 35th place finishes i could scream....but getting into a heads up duel with suited connectors is not on my list of ways to get better..good luck and i hope we meet at a final table soon [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]