$22: Push or wait with an uber short stack

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wait and hope for a better holding on which to risk all my chips.

all 330 of them.

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What are you getting at?

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That your equity in this tourney is already very low. So when talking about risking all of your chips as though you were risking a high likelihood of making the money it is a little misleading. OP already "risked" most of his chips...now he has to find the BEST spot possible to get back into this thing. These "best spots" might not seem so great, but then again, with 330, nothing will seem great.

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True, but its all the equity you've got.

The way I see it, this is a marginal situation in either case. I would probably go with my intuition and reads - but I certainly do not see that it is a slam-dunk case.

[GtrHtr]

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fwiw, I'm the one that initially told him this wasn't a super easy push, and I guess that's why he posted the hand. Hopefully we can get this ish back on track and move the trolling/troll-hunting to another thread.

This hand is really close imo. I don't think he has much FE over the BB at all - BB's probably calling like 80%+ of hands. Which if we put SB on 'M' in SNGPT, and BB at 80%, it's still +EV by like 0.2% if I remember correctly. Anyway, the problem is is that whenever the SB calls, the BB is almost always calling since now he has the chance to bust you AND he has very nice pot odds. So you get called by both players a fair % of the time, and the SB might even be calling as much as 30-40% of hands. When you get called by both players it's truly disastrous, regardless of your range.

I'd rather try to wait for a hand that has at least a decent chance of doubling you up when you go UI. J8o is just not good enough when there's the chance that you're up against two players. You may or may not get this hand...but I think it's a lot better to then just take your BB (I certainly would not push from UTG with this stack since you get called by 2+ players WAY too often). Your opponents will recognize that they have no FE and often give you a walk, or at worst you're probably only going up against one player.

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See what you started? NoOb Troll.

It's a fairly +EV push btw, which all but a few posters acknowledge, assuming the broader ranges you'd put BB on.

I think the problem comes when SB and BB "team up" and both call and check it down.

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Hero may be dealt a better hand for showdown value, but hero is more than likely not to be given a more +EV opportunity.

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Maybe, maybe not. For sure you'll be dealt a better hand than j8 offsuit.

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That's beside the point. In Hero's situation, the most number of potential callers is 2. If Hero folds and waits for better cards than J8o, there are now 5 possible opponents who may also pick up better cards themselves.

The chances of Hero getting better cards in the next three hands may be good (which I assume is your rationale for folding), but the chances of one of the other five players getting even better cards are higher.

[pergesu]

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What 45s said, plus, you need to apply this kind of thinking to the next two hands as well to get a feel for how crappy the situation REALLY is.

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I'm saying you don't need to push any of the next couple hands. In all likelihood, you'll end up racing in the BB. If you happen to get lucky enough to get a nice hand that you can shove, awesome. It's just better to race or even get a walk in the BB than it is to make EXTREMELY marginal pushes for your entire stack, even though it's quite small.

[pooh74]

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What 45s said, plus, you need to apply this kind of thinking to the next two hands as well to get a feel for how crappy the situation REALLY is.

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I'm saying you don't need to push any of the next couple hands. In all likelihood, you'll end up racing in the BB. If you happen to get lucky enough to get a nice hand that you can shove, awesome. It's just better to race or even get a walk in the BB than it is to make EXTREMELY marginal pushes for your entire stack, even though it's quite small.

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You want to get the most out of that stack in situations like these. It isnt about giving up, its all about the fact that you have an opportunity here to make HALF of the remaining players fold and to be HU a majority of the time. Your FE against SB is real...that's the crux of the argument.

If I had t140 I would wait for a better hand.

[rvg72]

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Wow, I had an almost identical situation occur last night in $11, except I was in small blind and had J9o, just a little over 300 chips. I called for 150, he then raised for my remainder. Guess I have to call here, right? He had KK and I lost. After the game I felt I made a horrible mistake... reading this thread has made me reconsider though.

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You shouldn't be calling here - either push or fold with 4BB left. If he had a smaller to mid stack then I'd say push since he would be much more likely to fold. If he had a very large stack then it would be a tougher decision but still probably a push for me with J9o.

rvg

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Is this REALLY what people think when playing poker? I always wanted to know.

All I have to say is...LOL.

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Please explain. Are your hand selection requirements the same from UTG as in late position?

If not, why does that answer not apply equally here?