Aces VS Kings

[thabadguy]

How would you play aces headsup on the flop when you "know" the opponent has kings, when opponent has position on you?
I like betting a miniscule amount on a rag flop ($200 into a $2000 pot) and invariably have been able to sucker the opponent to push. Is this something anyone else has done successfully? I dont know how it works, I mean, anyone should be able to know I have aces with the preflop war, but it DOES work! Comments?

[Marginilizer]

This is like asking, "How do you bet top set when you know villian has bottom set" or "How do you bet flopping nut straight when you know villian has over pair." The simple answer is: it doesn't matter. Villian's money is getting into the pot one way or the other. The only way you're not getting paid off here is if A) an Ace falls, B) some believable straight/flush comes the turn or C) he reads you correctly. Short of you showing him Aces/horribly playing your hand, he's going to call you down on a rags board.

[thabadguy]

I am not so sure about that, because I have seen people lay down kings on a rag flop with a pot or 3/4 pot bet after a war preflop. If you are in early position and you raise with aces ,kings reraise ..you reraise and he calls, I think you know he has kings and he knows you have aces. I was involved in a hand where i had kings and the opponent has aces, given he was a tight player, hadnt played a hand in an hour and put in the 3rd raise it was easy to see he had aces. It went check check on a Q high flop, check check on the turn and i spiked a king on the river. I have no idea why he checked it thru.

[freemoney]

if you flop a straight with a hand that you are willing to play for a raise to an overpair i think it is far from accurate to say that it doesnt matter how you play it because its not true he will lose his stack in this situation regardless of how you play it at all.

[Marginilizer]

OK, I'll admit that I was somewhat exaggerating. However, let's take this one by one. AA vs. KK after pre-flop raising war. Let's assume that KK (villian) raises , AA (hero) reraises and villian calls. Obviously, amount of raise/reraise matters, but the point is that villian calls the reraise and doesn't push/fold then. What flop will villian fold on that doesn't have an Ace? Possibly some holding a Q or J since he might put you on QQ or JJ. I don't see villian folding to a sub-pot sized bet on a rags flop under most circumstance. Yet again, table image is a factor, but let's not just assign hero a tight table image and make villian capable of reading hero for AA on the flop. That ignores the fact that JJ or QQ in the hands of tight player could be played the same way. I'm not saying that it's an easy decision for villian or that he'll call down/push all in every time, but it will be tough lay down to make. In this case, I see villian folding is if A) villian was fairly certain you had AA and needed to see your flop bet for validation or B) he knew pre flop and wanted to see if he could flop a set.
Now let's assume that that AA raises, KK reraises and AA calls. Yet again, amounts matter, but the point is that KK is effectively the aggressor. In this scenario (especially if KK is first act), I think KK's money is going to end up in the pot on a non-Ace flop.

As far as the straight comment, I wasn't referring to a heads up situation. If you're playing suited connectors for a raise heads up, I wish you good luck because you'll need it. I was referring to multi-way pots. I've seen scenarios like this develop because one of the MPs makes a respectable raise and a few loose players call giving odds to the later acts. Admittedly, anyone holding AA would be foolish to get too aggressive with over pair with 5 or more people in the hand, but I've seen it happen. In fact, I recall one such hand where I flopped the nut straight on 5 6 9 rainbow board with 78 suited after UTG raised 5x BB and 5 people called. I didn't get all of UTG's money in the pot until the turn, but I still got it in there.

What I'm really getting at is there are certain dream scenarios that we all love to ponder. Basically, hands where we have villian crushed, yet he has such a strong hand that it will be very difficult for him to lay it down. They're fun to play out in our heads, but they're few and far between. I'm much more interested in scenarios where hero has a strong hand on dangerous boards (2 pair on straight or flush board for example) and there is genuine doubt about whether hero is ahead.

[ChrisHasNoLife]

MIN RAISING IS WHAT PREDICTABLE FISH DO WHEN THEY HAVE MONSTERS, IDIOT, U BET HALF THE POT TO SUCKER HIM TO RE RAISE U THEN WHEN HE HAS TOO MUCH INVESTED IN THE POT TO FOLD, U KILL HIM (re. not litterally in no way do i advocate killings over the poker table)

[iceman5]

[ QUOTE ]
MIN RAISING IS WHAT PREDICTABLE FISH DO WHEN THEY HAVE MONSTERS, IDIOT, U BET HALF THE POT TO SUCKER HIM TO RE RAISE U THEN WHEN HE HAS TOO MUCH INVESTED IN THE POT TO FOLD, U KILL HIM (re. not litterally in no way do i advocate killings over the poker table)

[/ QUOTE ]


Typing in all caps and calling people "idiot" for no apparent reason, is what rude people do.