PL2000 hand ... Interested in the other guy's play here

[Wintermute]

http://www.pokerhand.org/index.php?p...amp;hand=70164

Looks like a bad call preflop,

pokenum -mc 500000 -o8 as 2d 8c ac - 6c ad 3c td
Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 500000 sampled boards
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
As Ac 8c 2d 248512 325785 174215 0 142918 76626 7757 0.645
6c 3c Ad Td 101778 174215 325785 0 104246 115024 7757 0.355

But on the flop he made the right play given the %'s...

Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 820 enumerated boards containing Kc Jh Th
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
As Ac 8c 2d 463 463 357 0 0 0 0 0.565
6c 3c Ad Td 357 357 463 0 0 0 0 0.435

However, just because he was getting correct odds this time doesn't necessarily mean this is the way to play his hand "correctly" in general (ie, not knowing my cards missed too). How do you play his hand in this case? Call or fold? I think you gotta fold his hand there, but I just want to assure myself this guy was an idiot.

[Ironman]

Of course, it's a terrible call. He got just a little more lucky than you.

I love the raise.

I don't know about that bet putting him all in. You really need to get lucky to avoid all his cards and let the aces hold up. It almost worked.

But...any guy who will make the call he did, with a board like that is someone you will get the money from in the end.

gl,

Dave

[GooperMC]

I think that he played it horribly but I am not sure that I like how you played it either.

That flop is UGLY for your hand. You are either going to be a little ahead or very far behind. Unless my opponent was a total donk (toots I am stealing your word) I would put this one under "when good hands go bad" and find better spot to put my money in.

[Wintermute]

I admit I was basically trying to buy it on the flop. But if I check the flop and he moves all-in, I'm getting (180+300):180 or a little better than 5:2 to call; I figure I'm going to have a hard time folding in that situation, since I know this guy will move in with any piece of the board, and only really perfect hands like 2 pair/set/str have me much worse than 75:25 -- 70:30. So, I moved in to get the extra folding equity in case the guy had a medium strengther.

But really my question has to do with the other guy's flop decision. The point of the post was, sure this time he's only behind 55:45, but you can't make that call routinely with his hand and expect to win in the long run, right?

This type of hand has me wondering how many times I am folding "horrible" hands like his when in fact the odds are right for a call if the cards were turned face up.

[JoshuaMayes]

You won't be playing a short stack like he was (I assume), so you won't be in a position to get odds like those with a terrible hand on the flop very often.

[GooperMC]

[ QUOTE ]
This type of hand has me wondering how many times I am folding "horrible" hands like his when in fact the odds are right for a call if the cards were turned face up.

[/ QUOTE ]
You are folding because I am assuming that the situation is different. In this hand your opponent was short stack and called 1/2 his chips with a mediocre drawing hand. I am assuming that you rarely play short stacked and when you do you will not play it like this.

[GooperMC]

Sorry I misread your opponents stack size. After looking more carefully at the hand I think a flop bet there is pretty close and would make my decision based on the opponent.

[JoshuaMayes]

If I was him, I would have had a full stack, and I would have limp-folded. If I misclicked and found myself still in the hand on the flop, I would have folded because I had a terrible hand.

edit -- oops, it was five handed, so I probably would have raise-folded rather than limp-folded.