kk vs maniac, dangerous monotone flop

creedofhubris · #1 11-03-2005, 05:04 PM

$5/$10 NL, villain has $550, I have him covered.

Villain is very loose preflop, raises a lot of trash, calls a lot of raises and reraises, gives action postflop. He's also eager to play me since I got most of his stack five minutes before by calling a monster turn raise with just a weak flush draw, which came in.

Villain makes it $30 from MP (standard with any 2), I make it $100 from CO with black KK, everyone else gets out of the way, he calls.

Flop: J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

Pot is $200. Villain ($450) checks. Your move, and plan for the rest of the hand?

Rocaix · #2 11-03-2005, 05:06 PM

Pot it, get all-in on the flop. I'd even consider, pushing when checked to.

FoxwoodsFiend · #3 11-03-2005, 05:08 PM

If this is a leak, it's a very small one-I don't get away from overpairs against shortstacks. bet the flop for about 200, call any all in, fold if he bets out when a heart comes. you can't be worried about the flush, and if he has the A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] it's a coinflip, but you I'd rather coinflip for another 450 then lose the pot if a heart comes after i've checked behind.

xorbie · #4 11-03-2005, 06:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Pot it, get all-in on the flop. I'd even consider, pushing when checked to.

[/ QUOTE ]

Worst advice ever.

Any random [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] with any random pair is a favorite right now.

Jason Strasser · #5 11-03-2005, 07:01 PM

Keep the pot small, check the flop. On the turn keep your options open. If he's viable to lead with a draw or combo draw with a pair, then you may want to raise a turn bet with the plan of checking the river. Just one option tho.

-Jason

oops did not see stack sizes. Check and evaluate turn.

xorbie · #6 11-03-2005, 07:01 PM

[ QUOTE ]
$5/$10 NL, villain has $550, I have him covered.

Villain is very loose preflop, raises a lot of trash, calls a lot of raises and reraises, gives action postflop. He's also eager to play me since I got most of his stack five minutes before by calling a monster turn raise with just a weak flush draw, which came in.

Villain makes it $30 from MP (standard with any 2), I make it $100 from CO with black KK, everyone else gets out of the way, he calls.

Flop: J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

Pot is $200. Villain ($450) checks. Your move, and plan for the rest of the hand?

[/ QUOTE ]

Look.. this flop sucks. It sucks hard. You're a favorite against A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]K or A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]Q and that's about it (and even that is a coinflip), so if any money goes in here with villain calling you're either a huge dog or a slight dog.

tdarko · #7 11-03-2005, 07:09 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Pot it, get all-in on the flop. I'd even consider, pushing when checked to.

[/ QUOTE ]
huh? you can't be serious?

tewall · #8 11-03-2005, 07:38 PM

From the way you've described the fellow, you must expect to be ahead of him. Plus the stacks are small. So I can't see how you can get away from being committed to all-in in this situation. Just because the flop sucks is no reason to assume it's hit him.

I think you need to assume you're ahead, which is very likely true (unless he's the type of player who would autobet unless he had something good to c/r with). You have to bet to protect your hand. A standard bet, like 150, is enough to keep him from calling correctly with nothing but a flush draw, so that seems fine. If he comes over the top, call without hesitation as your getting 4 to 1 for your call.

xorbie · #9 11-03-2005, 07:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]

From the way you've described the fellow, you must expect to be ahead of him.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why? 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] is only like a 60/40 dog here. There is no reason wathsoever to expect to be ahead. If hero had K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] I would be all over this too. But really, this is the worst ever flop.

tewall · #10 11-03-2005, 08:10 PM

I disagree that this is a bad flop. The chance of hero being behind is very small, given the range of hands villain will play. It's probably better than 4 to 1 that hero is ahead. If an Ace had flopped, that would be a bad flop, but this is a good flop. It's a flop where hero is likely to get action from a hand who he is favored against, as there are all sort of draws out there. Hero wants action, so he should bet. There's a good chance villian will go over the top with a draw, so give him the chance to do so.