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  #31  
Old 11-17-2005, 01:51 PM
Roman Roman is offline
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Default Re: Watching this years WSOP the final straw.

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I didn't think anyone that'd make final table woudl still open limp a hand like KJo

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**sigh** your post reeks of a cashgame player who knows very little but still likes to assume things about MTTs. There are many good reasons to limp with a hand like KJo, especially in CO. This is a play a lot of good tournament players would make on ocassion if the situation is right.
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  #32  
Old 11-17-2005, 02:38 PM
IHateCats IHateCats is offline
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Default Re: LET ME STICK MY FOOT IN MY MOUTH

For God's sakes, can't you read?

I specifically included Barch in the group that played well and wasn't included in the donkey group. So why are you going off on how solid he is?

And yes, I thought Black's KJo push was foolish as was Hachem's calling Danneman preflop with 73o HU, results aside.

Really, they only broadcast only part of the hands? You've got to be kidding me. <SARCASM indicator since your reading comprehension is clearly low> And yes I've read the hand by hand descriptions but without hole cards, those are limited as well. That is where the broadcast adds SOME value. That and obvious physical tells like Black was radiating with his set of 5's. And it certainly confirms how poorly Danneman and Kanter played.

I included David Williams in a GROUP that I rated as running from decent to very good, I didn't say David Williams in 2004 was at the better end of that group, I think Raymer and Arieh were clearly the class of the 2004 final table along with Harrington.

If you think this table was such a powerhouse, tell me, which would you rather play at the 2005 top 20 or the 2003 top 20 or the final tables of each? The point is that the experience and skill of the fields of the ultra high profile touraments, WSOP NLHE and WPT Foxwoods & probably Commerce is dropping more than rapidly enough to offset the high entry fees.
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  #33  
Old 11-17-2005, 02:48 PM
Roman Roman is offline
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Default Re: Watching this years WSOP the final straw.

I usually use this move before a final table because the players at a final table are generally stronger, but it is not at all uncommon as you may think even on a FT. Maybe this is not common amongst 2+2ers, but there are undeniable advantages of openlimping on certain tables/vs certain opponents.
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  #34  
Old 11-17-2005, 02:52 PM
BobboFitos BobboFitos is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2004
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Default Re: Watching this years WSOP the final straw.

[ QUOTE ]
I usually use this move before a final table because the players at a final table are generally stronger, but it is not at all uncommon as you may think even on a FT. Maybe this is not common amongst 2+2ers, but there are undeniable advantages of openlimping on certain tables/vs certain opponents.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, what are those advantages. Time to defend that position. Im here for learning.
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  #35  
Old 11-17-2005, 03:16 PM
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Default Re: LET ME STICK MY FOOT IN MY MOUTH

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[ QUOTE ]
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David is not a bad player, but some of the things he did were atrocious, and, had he not caught club-club on Mike McClaine, you wouldnt even know his name.



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I agree. A lot of people forget he was on his way out in 17th place, and off into obscurity forever (outside the Magic circles).

I think Williams is horrible. Way too over-aggressive. The epitome of an internet tourney donk.

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Nope. But you are the epitome of a watch 10 hands and render a final judgment on someone's play donk.
-James

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That makes it even more clear that he sucks. His HU play against Negreanu was the worst I've ever seen. It only took about 30 televised hands for me to understand just how donkish he can be.

I'm not saying he doesn't pull of good plays. But he can be ridiculously donkish at times, which makes him a bad poker player.

Plus I've logged over 3k* hands with him in NL cash games, live.


* By 3K, of course I am referring to zero.
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  #36  
Old 11-17-2005, 03:24 PM
James282 James282 is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 699
Default Re: LET ME STICK MY FOOT IN MY MOUTH

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
David is not a bad player, but some of the things he did were atrocious, and, had he not caught club-club on Mike McClaine, you wouldnt even know his name.



[/ QUOTE ]
I agree. A lot of people forget he was on his way out in 17th place, and off into obscurity forever (outside the Magic circles).

I think Williams is horrible. Way too over-aggressive. The epitome of an internet tourney donk.

[/ QUOTE ]

Nope. But you are the epitome of a watch 10 hands and render a final judgment on someone's play donk.
-James

[/ QUOTE ]

That makes it even more clear that he sucks. His HU play against Negreanu was the worst I've ever seen. It only took about 30 televised hands for me to understand just how donkish he can be.

I'm not saying he doesn't pull of good plays. But he can be ridiculously donkish at times, which makes him a bad poker player.

Plus I've logged over 3k* hands with him in NL cash games, live.


* By 3K, of course I am referring to zero.

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay, but making bad plays from time to time doesn't make you a bad player.
-James
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  #37  
Old 11-17-2005, 03:27 PM
turnipmonster turnipmonster is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 511
Default Re: Watching this years WSOP the final straw.

22 against a chronic reraiser?
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  #38  
Old 11-17-2005, 03:46 PM
woodguy woodguy is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Posts: 20
Default Re: Watching this years WSOP the final straw.

[ QUOTE ]

22 against a chronic reraiser?

[/ QUOTE ]

I like to open limp on the button with hands like KQs/AJo/QJs/small pairs and the like against chronic re-raisers (which everyone seems to be when you are at the last few tables and make a button raise)

Basically I'm avoiding bloating the pot too much PF, as I will call his raise, but the pot will be more like 8-10BB's + antes instead of 18-10BB's, and if we are only 30-50BB's deep by that time, it makes all the difference in the world in allowing me to use position for the rest of the hand.

If I raise it up PF he either blows me off my hand or I'm going to the felt with a hand that doesn't warrant it, those stack sizes can make PF raises tough with hands you really want to play (especially with position) but can't take any real heat, and need at least 2 streets of betting to play well

That's my take. I play a lot of tourneys, but generally am not as good as most here at deep stack NLHE.

Regards,
Woodguy
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  #39  
Old 11-17-2005, 03:50 PM
psuasskicker psuasskicker is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 91
Default Re: Watching this years WSOP the final straw.

Donkfest, maybe...

I'll just say this. Anyone that thinks they can play 5-6 days straight for 16+ hours per day and then sit down and play another 24 - 30 hour session with millions of dollars at stake in front of millions of TV viewers, and not make a few mistakes along the way, has got one helluvan ego. Not that that's a bad thing, just sayin' it's not easy to do that and not make a few mistakes in that last session.

- C -
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  #40  
Old 11-17-2005, 04:20 PM
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: LET ME STICK MY FOOT IN MY MOUTH

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
David is not a bad player, but some of the things he did were atrocious, and, had he not caught club-club on Mike McClaine, you wouldnt even know his name.



[/ QUOTE ]
I agree. A lot of people forget he was on his way out in 17th place, and off into obscurity forever (outside the Magic circles).

I think Williams is horrible. Way too over-aggressive. The epitome of an internet tourney donk.

[/ QUOTE ]

Nope. But you are the epitome of a watch 10 hands and render a final judgment on someone's play donk.
-James

[/ QUOTE ]

That makes it even more clear that he sucks. His HU play against Negreanu was the worst I've ever seen. It only took about 30 televised hands for me to understand just how donkish he can be.

I'm not saying he doesn't pull of good plays. But he can be ridiculously donkish at times, which makes him a bad poker player.

Plus I've logged over 3k* hands with him in NL cash games, live.


* By 3K, of course I am referring to zero.

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay, but making bad plays from time to time doesn't make you a bad player.
-James

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay, so 85% of the time he's totally average. 15% of the time he's the worlds sickest donk.

You win.
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