5/10 NL QQ- Uhh, i have no idea, so I donk-call all the way

[greygoo]

Hands like this make me feel really stupid, because it just seems so wrong to call without a resemblance of a read/plan of action on the next street. To make matter worse, not only it bloats the pot, it doesn't reduce confusion at all.

Man, this is ugly.

I have been pretty quiet at the table and not paying too much attention to action on the table(other tables are SH, so I try to pay more attention there). I have played a decent amount of hands with villain, but have no particular read on him. He seems somewhat aggresive, capable of making moves, but I can't recall anything out of line. Villain probably is aware that I am very aggressive, especially in position.

5/10 NL, 8-handed

Hero (1729)
Villain (1189.5)

2 limpers and I make it 60 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] on the button, only BB calls

Flop ($145): 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
BB checks, Hero bets $100, BB raises $265.00, Hero calls

I CB flops like that probably almost always. People play back at me once in a while, so villain range is probably pretty wide, so fold is out of option I think. Villain probably just calls with a draw though.

Turn($675): 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Villain bets $260, Hero calls $260
Huh? I have no idea, what this bet means. AJ, KJ with/without a spade, scared set, or he just tries to lure me deeper with a flush.

River($1195): 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Villain insta-pushes for $604, I think "wtf,wtf,wtf" for a minute and call.

His river timing tilted me towards the call, but I am not particularly interested in the river. I think I should not be in this spot on the river, because there is got to be a better way to play it on flop and turn, so I either go all the way or let the hand go.

Thoughts?

[phillydilly]

*** this is far above what i normally play***

I think this is a turn laydown
you could be against a preflop-slowplayed AA KK JJ
you could be against the made flush
about the only thing you are ahead of is AJ here

I think the flop call is ok because if a non A,K, [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] comes down, you can lead big/push, but on the turn, a lot of the hands you were ahead of, you are now behind.

All this is said with the note that i have no idea how fiercely blinds are defended at this level

[captZEEbo1]

turn you probably lay down....one of those if I wasn't behind on flop I'm probably behind now

[creedofhubris]

Once you call the flop reraise you should be planning to drop if a spade hits on the turn.

[crosse91]

what do we do with a blank turn (non A,K, or spade) and the same bet? reraise? and how much? (All in?)

[greygoo]

Appreciate your thoughts, guys.

Given my agresssive image, should I consider 3-betting the flop once in a while here to discourage people to play back at me in spots like this? Say, to 600 or so. By default villain has to put me on big pair/AK (would be wrong though), so if he pushes I could probably still get away when I figure I'm against a set. It doesn't look like a big spade draw like A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. It would shut down most of the draws, except really big ones. Big draw might push back, but he's got to think after my 3-bet that his folding equity is very small, which should slow him down. Btw, in this case you would think that draw would want to bet out/push after raise, given default "big pair" assumption about my hand. Also 3-bet might generate more action for me if, god forbid, this somehow goes to showdown (there were a lot of regulars on the table).

His turn bet is weird. If he has a flush, shouldn't he be worried about 4th spade coming and ruining his action? You would think villain would want to get more money into the pot. Of course, because of the stacks, this might be a luring bet to tie me to the pot. But it also maybe "can we please see showdown with my AJ? i can still save half of my stack" bet.

I think laying down turn has some merits. What I'm mostly concerned with though is if i lay my hand down here too often, this would be a no-brainer relatively cheap playback against me. CR the flop, make a weak-ass lead on any scare turn card - I lay down without a monster. I was most likely folding to the river all in though, but he pushed way too fast for me to think he had a flush or set so I looked him up.

Villain showed 55. So maybe my thoughts are skewed by results here. But results are irrelevant as I'm more concerned about playing the hand the way so I have better idea what to do. Pushing people around from position results in stinky spots like this. Oh, well. I think I can find a fold on the turn without a better read.

Any thoughts about 3-betting the flop?

[creedofhubris]

[ QUOTE ]


Any thoughts about 3-betting the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

Villain can't make a mistake if you 3-bet the flop: he lays down hands that are beat; he pushes with hands that beat you.

If you raise the flop you're in for some ticklishness if a spade comes on the turn.

Raising a non-spade, non-jack turn is probably a better default line than raising the flop.

[greygoo]

Yes, you are right. But I avoid playing poker on later streets =)

imo he made his flush on the turn and soft played it to see if you'd come along. The insta-push on the river is an excellent way to stir up your emotions so you can't think it thru in the 20 second allotted time, and you have "This won't hurt, did it?" lol