TT 1st hand versus big raise at limpers from SB: push, call, or fold

[betgo]

First hand of $50 supersatellite on Paradise for seats in $600 MTT. UTG position limps 20, I limp in 2nd position with TT, 4th position limps, button limps. SB raises to 200, UTG calls. Should I push, call, or fold?

[Firefly]

I'd fold and watch the player carefully over the next couple of hands. I'd push JJ+ i think.

[Crispy]

Yeah I do the same. Very risky business by putting your chips in a scenario where you have no reads.

[betgo]

Why fold rather than call?

[FiReSiStAnT]

Because you have no reads, he could easily have at least AQ

But wait

It also seems that he could have a lower pocket pair, 88s or 99s are possible especially in online play...

However, i think due to your position (2nd place to act) you have to fold here and wait for a better situation...

[betgo]

I pushed. There was 500 in the pot and 1500 in my stack. I felt I had some pot odds and folding equity, although as the 2nd limper my limpraise lacked some credibility.

If UTG had JJ-AA, he was playing it very strangely by limp/calling. The raise of 10xBB 2xpot did not look like a big pair to me. Also, since the raise came from the blinds, it looked like he might be just trying to steal the pot. I thought there was some chance SB had a smaller pair than mine or some other hand I dominated. I thought I might be dealing with a loose fish who wanted to gamble.

SB called and UTG folded. SB showed QJs, which was a good result for me, since I was ahead 53-47 with 55-45 pot odds, so I was getting about 58-42 on my money. I felt like one of those loose fish maniacs when the hands were exposed, but I think my play was reasonable given the way the hand had gone. Villain made 2 pair, so the actual result was not good, as I was the first player to bust out of the satellite.

[KramerTM]

[ QUOTE ]
If UTG had JJ-AA, he was playing it very strangely by limp/calling. The raise of 10xBB 2xpot did not look like a big pair to me. Also, since the raise came from the blinds, it looked like he might be just trying to steal the pot. I thought there was some chance SB had a smaller pair than mine or some other hand I dominated. I thought I might be dealing with a loose fish who wanted to gamble.

[/ QUOTE ]

Those are a lot of reads for no reads.

[ QUOTE ]
SB showed QJs, which was a good result for me, since I was ahead 53-47 with 55-45 pot odds, so I was getting about 58-42 on my money.

[/ QUOTE ]

Aren't these the exact types of +cEV situations we look to ignore early in the tournament? Unless you are the worst post-flop player in the history of hold'em, I think you needed to fold here.

[betgo]

[ QUOTE ]
Those are a lot of reads for no reads.

[/ QUOTE ]


I didn't say there were no reads. Just because it's the first hand doesn't mean I can't pick up something from the betting pattern. Plus, I have played in these before and know there are a lot of loose fish and wild early action.

[ QUOTE ]
Aren't these the exact types of +cEV situations we look to ignore early in the tournament? Unless you are the worst post-flop player in the history of hold'em, I think you needed to fold here.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are conceeding this is chip EV+ and saying it is a bad play. Even though this is a supersatellite and I don't need to make the big money, there is 1 seat for 13 players, so I don't mind playing double or nothing.

[ChipsAhoya]

[ QUOTE ]
Even though this is a supersatellite and I don't need to make the big money, there is 1 seat for 13 players, so I don't mind playing double or nothing.

[/ QUOTE ]

I like this play, I don't think you're vs. a big pair either and there's a lot of dead money in the pot...

I think a lot of people are too skittish about gambling in tournaments; like those who wouldn't call an all-in w/ QQ vs. AK on the first hand of a tournament. I'm going to make that play later in a tournament, so if I'm going to lose w/ a pair vs. overcards, it's better to bust 1st than on the bubble. Sure, once you lose your chips, you're done, but you can just start another tourney, unless the buy-in is prohibitively expensive, like a WSOP main event where you might not want to gamble all your chips on the first hand. You have to win chips to win money, so you might as well go for it from the start.

If you're considering pushing all-in, you could also try a stop and go and push an A- or K- less flop. These are agressive plays, no doubt, but I think they will work out well because if you do win, you will have a very large stack w/ very small blinds for a while. Sorry it didn't work out that time, though...

have a nice day,
ChipsAhoya