Poll -- What is Hero's error in this $33 hand

[Mr_J]

I don't call the preflop raise. Early on in the 800 stacks I play JJ for cheap. With the way he bet preflop and that flop I expect to see qq+.

[Jbrochu]

I would raise pre-flop. When the likely re-raise came from the K's, I would probably push unless this guy's been an absolute rock. If the K's flat called the pre-flop raise, I'm going broke after the flop.

[nate_king1]

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe its just me but folding PF after you've limped with jacks seems way too weak tight. Just because someone raises a couple limpers doesn't mean they have QQ-AA, in fact, they probably don't have QQ-AA. I agree with 45suited, if you don't go broke you're either awful or one of the top players there are.

[/ QUOTE ]

But he did have it. Its not weak tight. It was his mistake to limp/call. It should of been bet/fold.

[durron597]

Let's look at the preflop raise. If he is solid he either has big cards or has you beaten, with the possible exception of TT. So if you just call preflop, you probably won't get too much more action out of a hand that you beat, or he outflops you and then you don't want the action.

The problem is that you never gave him a chance to tell you if he has you beat. His continuation bet could mean anything.

I would fold preflop to the raise with these stack sizes. But if you're going to call, I would make a probe bet (t150 or so) and fold to a push. But I don't really like that line because you don't win enough the times he has big cards to make up for the amount you lose when you are crushed; the stacks are just not deep enough to get away from this post flop really.

Position is king. Fold preflop.

[Steve]

[ QUOTE ]

I disagree, it would definately be -EV if the stacks were deeper, but w/ 800 chips, its not -EV to take a pass here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Maulik are you saying if the stacks were DEEPER you'd be willing to play this a little farther (i.e. bet or call on the flop), but given the size of the stacks its either AI or fold on the flop, so you choose fold?

[curtains]

If only you all knew how much I hate limping in here with JJ. I think its just terrible, but everyone seems to like it!

[45suited]

[ QUOTE ]
If you can't get rid of jacks in this spot you might want to learn why you should. I've laid down Kings when and Aces flops (NO BIG DEAL, I knew I was beat). You need to make good laydowns to beat SNGs and Poker. Simple as that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Huge difference between laying down kings when an ace flops and this scenario. Hero doesn't have enough of a stack to lay down an overpair to this flop.

I'll venture to guess for every "good laydown" you make in spots like this, you're giving up several pots and leaving a lot of money on the table. So when he called pre-flop, what kind of flop should he have been hoping for exactly? Trip jacks?

Sometimes you're just destined to go broke. This hand is one of them.

[mmbt0ne]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">En réponse à:</font><hr />
But he did have it. Its not weak tight. It was his mistake to limp/call. It should of been bet/fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you mean he should raise/fold preflop or bet/fold the flop? Bet/folding the flop is AWFUL.

[Tony Corbett]

Your poll omits my preference which would be to open with a push on the flop. By going for the check raise with your now small stack your opponent has great pot odds and would struggle to now find a fold on the flop. I want him to fold becuase if I don't hit a set with JJ I always want them to fold early in a tourney.

[mmbt0ne]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">En réponse à:</font><hr />

If only you all knew how much I hate limping in here with JJ. I think its just terrible, but everyone seems to like it!

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. I don't think I've ever limped UTG+1 with JJ. Maybe in late position after 6 or 7 limpers I could see making a case for limping and hoping for a good flop, but UTG+1?