damn you, clarkmeister

[Wynton]

Villain is a TAG.

I get 2 red 10s in the bb.

MP calls. CO raises. Folded to me. I reraise.
MP folds, and CO calls.

Flop 10c9s8c. I bet, co calls.

Turn is 7c. I bet? Villain raises. Groan. I call.

River is 2c. I bet. CO raises, I fold.

[Somekid]

I play it the same.

[thesharpie]

I'd bet the turn. I don't understand the river bet, someone needs to link to the clarkmeister thread, I'm not sure if I've ever read it properly.

I think he's calling/raising all better hands and folding almost all worse hands, probably isn't bluff raising worse hands but might bluff bet if you check, and the occasional times he does bluff raise it's disastrous.

ok, the only reason i don't worry about the river line is that at lower stakes i find almost no TAG opponents will raise that river without beating your hand. And many will bet on a steal so you will have to call. The question is, do more weaker hands call your bet that would have checked than weaker hands that would have bet the river for you to call.
If you can give your opponent credit for the river raise witha bluff then you have a whole new discussion, here, i did not.

[kapw7]

[ QUOTE ]
I think he's calling/raising all better hands and folding almost all worse hands, probably isn't bluff raising worse hands but might bluff bet if you check, and the occasional times he does bluff raise it's disastrous.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly.

Bet/fold would be better if you had a pair of tens or something but still not a good idea b/c of the straight possibility.

By check-calling you can get paid by hands like a pair of tens or nines or 2 pairs etc or a pure bluff.

[jrz1972]

[ QUOTE ]
By check-calling you can get paid by hands like a pair of tens or nines or 2 pairs etc

[/ QUOTE ]

Villain might call with those hands if you bet, but he's probably not betting them if you check to him. As I understand it, that's the main rationale for betting these sorts of rivers. The board is so scary that many villains will check behind with hands you beat but will make a crying call if you bet.

In other words, this is a spot where villain will call with more hands than he'll bet. Hence the river bet.

[kapw7]

[ QUOTE ]

In other words, this is a spot where villain will call with more hands than he'll bet. Hence the river bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

TAGs bet more hands than they call with.
I agree that its unlikely to bluff bet this but it's also unlikely to call with a pair.
If you want to invest 1 bet on this river then I prefer to c/c than b/f
TAGs are probably aware of the Clark play and they might try a bluff raise here (I will definitely try it against a 2p2er not this board tho).

EDIT: I missed that we were raised on the turn here. The only likely hand that we beat is a pair or a smaller set if they haven't made a flush.

[admiralfluff]

Clarkmeister is least applicable when HU agaisnt TAGs. There is no reason to bet this river besides that Clark sais to. He will not fold anything that beats you ever. c/c this river.

[jason_t]

After you lost the lead on the turn, check/call the river.

[xwillience]

check call the river, what do u put him on that beats you tho. JT, maybe KJ or AJ, cant think of anything else. but i would have expected some action on the flop with an OESD from a TAG I would almost tend to lean that he was a smaller set or two pair?