Horrific Hollywood Park ruling

[phish]

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The instant cards hit the muck, they're dead.

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I know I repeat myself a lot on this, but people keep saying it. The muck has no magical powers that kills anything it touches. There simply is no rule that a hand is dead for touching the muck.

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Except that if a hand is solidly in the muck (or even just on top of it), there will always be some question as to which cards are his. If there's any doubt, the hand should be declared dead.

[Randy_Refeld]

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Except that if a hand is solidly in the muck (or even just on top of it), there will always be some question as to which cards are his. If there's any doubt, the hand should be declared dead.

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If the hand is in the muck there is no way to retrieve it so it isn't a matter of the hand be declared dead as much as their being no hand to make a ruling on. Nothing should ever be placed on top of the muck, when a player gives up their cards they should be mucked so they are not retrievable. If someone's hand merely touches the muck their is no reason to make it ineligible for the pot (there may have been something that occurred just before it touched the muck that makes it dead, but the muck itself has no magical powers).