Rounders/Poker Pros

[Ashe]

Was thinking of what it takes to go pro & came up with a few questions...

1. Is a rounder, someone playing for a living, considered a pro?

2. How many rounders/pros are really out there?

3. Do they make most of their money in tournaments or regular play?

4. Do they mostly live in Las Vegas?

5. What limits do they usually play?

6. What percentage of players who try to go pro actually make it?

7. Can I borrow a dollar?

Thanks [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

[Ashe]

ok, maybe this isn't a psych question or I phrased it wrong, but I was wondering about my misconceptions about pros.

Anyway, here they are. I think that a rounder is a professional poker player. There is probably less than 1,000 of em in the US. They probably make most of their money in tournaments. If I was a pro, I think I'ld move to Vegas. And probably more than half the people who try to go pro end up failing.

Any comments? [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

[Nottom]

Here's my answers:

1) Yes, they earn a living playing poker so are therefore professionals.

2) Hard to say, except that there are probably many more people who claim to be than actually are.

3) Most make their money in ring games although there are certainly a group of tourney pros as well.

4) Vegas I'm sure has a higher per capita level of pros but anywhere there are good poker games there will be someone there trying to make a living at it. There are certainly plenty in California and the NorthEast as well.

5) To really make a decent living I think 15/30 or 20/40 is the minimum unless the games are very good.

6) Not many. Some will do well for a while, maybe even for a couple years but eventually most will fail.

7) Sounds like you are well on your way to becoming a pro.

*** Note: all answers expressed in this e-mail are from a person who is not, and has no intentions of becoming a professional ... although I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

[Kurn, son of Mogh]

The majority of professional poker players in the US do not play in tournaments. And I'll venture to say there are more than 1,000.

[Glenn]

"They probably make most of their money in tournaments. "

The pros that make their living in tournaments are generally the broke ones.

[Dynasty]

[ QUOTE ]
They probably make most of their money in tournaments.

[/ QUOTE ]

As a couple people have already mentioned, this is the one assumption you've made which is definitely wrong.

[PokerBabe(aka)]

A stat I once read suggests that less than 1% of "serious" poker players are "successful pros". Most of the pros I know make their living in ring games and most play 15-30 and higher. Playing professionally is very, very difficult. The one downfall of many wannabe pros is an insufficient bankroll. Many people underestimate the "variance" in games above 15-30, and when the inevitable drawdowns occur, you cannot be short on cash. Some of the best players I know have lost 200 big bets in a month. That seems hard to belive, but it is true.

Of course, one thing to remember at all times is LGPG. Good Luck Babe [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

[Saborion]

Seems like a lot of people agree that tournament playing is not a good way to make money. Why is that?

The risk factor is higher?

I assume lots of good players make money in regular games and play the occasional tournament for various reasons?

[Al Schoonmaker]

The best work on professionals is "Poker Faces" by Dr. Hayano. It is dated, but based on solid research.
At least 90% of the wannabees fail. They may make a marginal or even a good living for a year or even five years, but hardly any of them have a successful, lifelong career.
Las Vegas is NOT a good place to be a professional. The local competition is too tough.
Hardly any tournament professionals have any money.
Even the greats are forced to make a significant percentage of their income from other sources such as writing and working for online poker sites.
I have no idea how many professionals there are, but I am certain that far more people claim to be professionals than actually make a decent living at it.
Regards,
Al

[Josh W]

I remember reading a highly respected tourny pro (I don't remember who, but I want to say Eric Seidel) say that a very very good tourny pro, over the course of an average year, will win about 100,000. This is because it is a VERY expensive lifestyle, always on the road, paying too much for food, lodging, and transportation.

There are way way way way (I think) more ring-game pro's than tourny pro's. I'd also guess that there are more in LA than anywhere else in the US (raw numbers, not per capita). I say this simply because LA has more games spread daily in the 15-30 and up range than any other part of America I'm aware of....thus it can support more pros.

I also think that turning pro is one of the worst things a person can do to their poker career. I would guess (I haven't done the math) that a person with a $60k/yr job who plays 15 hrs. of poker/wk. will, within about 1 year be making much more money from poker than that same player as a pro. This is because the worker (non-pro) will be able to move up in limits much faster, as he can take on a much higher risk of ruin, his bankroll grows much faster since he isn't paying for bills out of poker money, etc....

Thus ends my editorial.

Josh