ESPN's coverage hurts the game

[Sly_Grin]

Just like last year they seem intent on featuring the biggest assholes, therefore assuring the following year will have even MORE people acting like assholes to get on TV. Last year it was the screaming Swede (I think) with the "Ja !!!" every 10 minutes, but that was nothing compared to this year's King of the A-holes, Barry Paskin.

It's obnoxious enough to have someone scream at the top of their lungs during the entire showdown, but for that person to smell so bad the floor gets called sets a new low. I love his logic - being told that his shirt stinks, a fact he admits while proudly saying he never washes it, is INSULTING. How about my fist in your mouth, would that be insulting ? At least Mattias just gave one obnoxious yell when winning his hand, this guy is obviously just trying to get as much attention as possible.

If ESPN just ignored these idiots they'd pretty much disappear, but by keeping a camera on the disgusting [censored] it just encourages him.

Personally I found myself with the overwhelming urge to remove all the hair on his head and face with a weedwhacker and blast him with a fire hose. And I'm pretty calm, I can just imagine the reaction from those viewers more easily annoyed than me.

suggestion - less assholes, more Shannon Elizabeth. Announcers that actually have a clue about poker strategy wouldn't hurt either.

[Joey Legend]

Lets get ol' McMannus to go up to Norman Chad and tell him he's disrespecting the game.

[SoftcoreRevolt]

I whole heartedly agree. For everyone saying OMG NORMAN CHAD WAS ACTUALLY FUNNY WITH HIS 800th HELLMUTH JOKE, they need to sit back and think what Hellmuth's act does. He gets so much camera time to whine and overact (like he doesn't know he's going to get camera time if he acts that way.) and this is what people are presented as being one of the top tournament pros, giving someone the impression that poker is like this.

Then you get 2 seconds of a player and a comment "This man is a class act and a testament to... sorry breaking news, we must cut to some loud ass over here!"

The good guys get 10 seconds of face time, the people making a scene get 55 minutes.

Rather than ignoring the idiots, ESPN treats poker like a giant freak show full of the same Hellmuth act, the same two dozen ex wife show, and a loud stupid celebration.

Yes these things happen and yes they will generate interest, but if so much focus is put on them, they overwhelm the game, and people will be way less likely to say "Hey this looks like fun, I'll try to play online" because who the hell wants to be berated for 10 minutes about not knowing how to play. The WSOP is supposed to be the place where anyone can win in the minds of the average Joe, not the place where you can be yelled at for being a donkey on National TV.

And when you combine it with announcers who do not take the game seriously, (except for the quick cut to Doyle Brunson and then quickly back to the morons.) you just make poker look like one giant unfunny joke about nonexistant ex wives. They don't need to know about poker strategy. Just have announcers who sound interested, (in the style of Rose and Konik, but not with someone as highly annoying as Konik.) they help make the game sound important, and give people an idea of what's going on, which helps people get more interested in the actual game.

[shaniac]

It doesn't hurt the game, and it's not keeping anyone away.

It's true that [censored]-ish behavior attracts the ESPN cameras, but I don't think that makes it a desireable away to attract attention. Dan Druff's performance is only the most recent cautionary tale.

If you'll notice, Mattias Anderson is nowhere to be seen this year.

And as for attracting novice poker players, all the college-kid-Joe-Random success stories do more to attract and engage new players than one stinky jerkoff Scottish guy could ever do to repel them.

I don't think we should include Phil Hellmuth in this discussion, since his [censored]-ish bheavior has grown into an all-encompassing study in human pathology, deserving of excessive air time.

[Photoc]

I just think that 45 minutes of bullshit with maybe 10 poker hands in there is ridiculous. This has to be the WORST ME coverage I've ever seen. Some dickhead screaming at the top of his lungs is not entertainment. ESPN, Grow up and show something people want to see. IF they want to see idiots yelling and screaming, well, go watch Celebrity Poker Showdown.

[MicroBob]

[ QUOTE ]

If ESPN just ignored these idiots they'd pretty much disappear

[/ QUOTE ]



I REALLLY REALLY REALLY wish this was true.
Unfortunately, it isn't.


I hate these guys too...everyone from Hellmuth to Matusow to Barry-the-stinky-screamer.
But not showing them won't stop people from acting like idiots.


FWIW - Lon and Norm continually referred to Barry's screaming as 'unspeakable' and also threw in some insults about Hellmuth's antics.
So they aren't exactly glorifying it. But obviously ESPN IS giving them more air-time specifically BECAUSE they are jerk-offs.


I hate the behavior as well...but isn't really ESPN's fault imo.

If the WSOP management and floor had any stones they would actually enforce some rules of appropriate behavior.

This goes WAY beyond the f'bomb rule.
There's just no reason that they have to sit back and let Barry stand on the top of his chair and scream at the top of his lungs.

Give the guy a penalty for doing just that even if there is no profanity involved. It's pretty obvious to everyone that he is not behaving in an appropriate mannger. But the officials just sit there and watch him as if they can't do anything about the stupid, stinky maniac who is disrupting the whole freaking event.

[Rick Nebiolo]

You and the OP have the best one-two post combo I've ever seen.

Regards,

Rick

[Saddlepoint]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think we should include Phil Hellmuth in this discussion, since his [censored]-ish bheavior has grown into an all-encompassing study in human pathology, deserving of excessive air time.

[/ QUOTE ]

He should get his own channel.

It seems to me that Norman Chad is actually making an effort to point out and praise "model" table behavior this year, and that if anything he's going after the Matusows even harder. Obviously this is subjective but it's something I've noticed, and maybe other people have as well. Now I might be talking out of my ass here, but why do you people think he's doing that? He could just be a pompous dick. But I think the more likely explanation is that he's aware of precisely the effect you're alluding to, and he wants to use his stage to teach all these new players how someone should act.

If that's the case, he's going above and beyond anything that we have the right to expect of him. The poker boom exists now because people watch poker on TV, which requires that it be entertaining to a broader audience than 2+2ers. That means more smelly-shirt-guy. Take the good with the bad.

I'm not completely sure what infuriates you so much about these people being given air time by ESPN. Even if it wasn't an inevitability, which it is, do you think it would really encourage people to act this way at a poker table when there aren't any cameras around? Especially when the color guy points out ten times an hour that it's not appropriate? And ESPECIALLY when none of these jackasses are ever shown winning anything?

That last point's really important. These people might get air time, but pay attention to the way they're presented. It would be a LOT different if you had guys like Ivey or Ferguson fist-pumping and shouting and [censored]. They don't hype guys like that, they "Dan Druff" them. The one exception is obviously Hellmuth, but it's my impression that they're even presenting him this year as someone not to be taken very seriously. Again, subjective.

And the idea that any of this is going to drive new players away is dumb, honestly.

[shaniac]

[ QUOTE ]
I just think that 45 minutes of bullshit with maybe 10 poker hands in there is ridiculous.

[/ QUOTE ]

I suspect you don't represent what the average viewer is interested in.

People who complain about the "quality of poker commentary" don't seem to realize that ESPN is obviously not trying to provide detailed, in-depth poker advise ala Lederer. Two guys sitting there making goofy comments and plain observations is apparently a more succesful formula.

I enjoy the overall tenor of the commentary and sort of like the fact that poker is presented as something light and fun. I also think the proportion of non-hand-related sketches to NL hands creates a better product than the WPT, which shows a lot more hands but is way less entertaining.

[SoftcoreRevolt]

The thing is, he's almost needlessly going after Mike. When Mike is just obviously joking around and being a clown you hear "The new mike, Same as the old Mike" in the same tone as when he blows up and is angry, making light of what he said at the end of the prison segment.

In Hellmuth's case, he's sort of jokingly portrayed in a wacky "That's our Phil, ain't he crazy!" light. "What's that say, Poker brat?" isn't said in a tone of scorn, but more light heartedly said. After his fluff segment on his family, that isn't being shot down in the same way Mike's segment is, all that's said is "His wife must be a saint" "I hope she charges him a good rate!" when everything Phil says is totally unlike Mike. Mike's comments are about 60% self depricating, Phil is 90% "Everyone else sucks but me, you stupid donkey."

Yes, the screaming Brit isn't portrayed in the best light, but why is he even being shown? Was he important at all to the tournament? No! While you may not prevent another guy from acting like an idiot, you do set a general tone. Notice how the screaming and carrying on is far reduced on WPT broadcasts (although it is still there in places) and almost non existant on FSN broadcasts like Poker at the Plaza? The announcers just make note of how professional everyone acts, and how you don't see them acting like a fool, and they move on to the next hand.

We've seen how heavily ESPN edits the play of hands, it wouldn't be a trick for them to just be rid of the annoying incidents such as Matias. But they don't. You can have the announcers criticize it all day, but in the end if you show it, it falls under the category of there's no such thing as bad publicity.

And in televised poker's case, instead of giving it so much bad publicity, it could be given much better publicity.

Now, some people have said they enjoy the more "fun" broadcast ESPN shows, and that the serious WPT shows are more dull.

How is a Hellmuth rant "fun"? We've all heard it before, in fact he's in reruns. We've already heard the "Without luck I'd win em all" line 3 times on the WSOP and WPT. Yeah that sure is a genuine blow up, and not a guy acting in front of the cameras. Want a fun broadcast? Show the first 30 seconds, the "he can't even spell poker!" line, and then cut to an intertitle in the style of a silent movie.

"Phil Hellmuth continued to rant for the next 20 minutes"
"Yes, a middle aged man continued to act like a 10 year old in an attempt to get on TV, since he couldn't get on TV for winning poker hands"
"Instead of showing that, we'll return you to your regularly scheduled WSOP broadcast."

See what that does? It makes Hellmuth look like a fool. It actually makes fun of him, instead of telling a joke related to him. Norman Chad's jokes don't actually make fun of him, since they aren't that mean spirited. It's more "Hey look at me I'm Norman Chad aren't I funny!"

But ESPN wouldn't dare make their star Freak attraction look like a fool, he might get mad and boycott the WSOP! Or worse yet, he might realize his antics won't get him on TV anymore, and he might act like a human being, and ESPN can't have that.

Instead Hellmuth gets 5 minutes of add time for UB, his clothing line, and any other products he might want to show off the next time he pulls up in a limo.