Two Plus Two Older Archives  

Go Back   Two Plus Two Older Archives > Internet Gambling > Internet Gambling

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-02-2005, 12:14 PM
gisb0rne gisb0rne is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 62
Default Why is rake so high, and why isn\'t competition driving it down?

There are more poker sites than there were several years ago, with more players, yet rake remains ridiculously high. If I 4 table 200+15 SNGs that's $60-75 an hour I'm paying in rake. The rake at the online cardrooms is as high as B&M cardrooms but you get none of the amenities. No waiters, free food, friendly staff, comfy seats, etc.

I also play online massively multiplayer roleplaying games where they charge $15 a month for unlimited play. Online games like Guild Wars charge nothing for unlimited play. These games have large development costs and high maintenance costs yet still charge far less than 1% of what I pay Party/Stars each month. What's going on here and why aren't there competing sites doing anything about it? I imagine you could profitably run a site with 1/4 the rake or less, especially if you get massive volume like Party.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-02-2005, 12:23 PM
meow_meow meow_meow is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 180
Default Re: Why is rake so high, and why isn\'t competition driving it down?

first, I don't think online rake is as high as B&M, though it is still very high. Also, you don't have to toke the dealer.
I assume the reason that competition isn't driving down the rake is that for the casual player rake is way, way down the list of considerations when selecting a site, and lets face it, the casual player is who you want to be playing against.

I'm guessing that if a site's major selling point was "we have the lowest rake on the net", then it might be a less profitable place to play than, for example, party.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-02-2005, 12:26 PM
busguy busguy is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 274
Default Re: Why is rake so high, and why isn\'t competition driving it down?

[ QUOTE ]
The rake at the online cardrooms is as high as B&M cardrooms . . .

[/ QUOTE ]

This is not correct.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-02-2005, 12:27 PM
Moesendreck Moesendreck is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 26
Default Re: Why is rake so high, and why isn\'t competition driving it down?

That's the kind of competition Absolute is bringing in at the moment. You get a good chunk of your rake back with their never ending bonuses. Same with Bodog, for example.

On the other hand, the money goes where the fish are. Party has a terrible rake structure for their lowest limit games 0,5/1 and 1/2, but still masses come playing there every day and most posters here would rather pay 100% rake as of today to keep the (fishy) games alive than see some sites cutting back on the rake, but having no fishy customers. That said, if there were 3 or more sites with about the same player base, there would be real competition going on which would affect rake structure.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-02-2005, 12:28 PM
canis582 canis582 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: I, state your name...
Posts: 178
Default Re: Why is rake so high, and why isn\'t competition driving it down?

Canis582 opens a can of worms and what comes out? www.rakefree.com
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-02-2005, 12:32 PM
Piers Piers is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 246
Default Re: Why is rake so high, and why isn\'t competition driving it down?

[ QUOTE ]
The rake at the online cardrooms is as high as B&M cardrooms

[/ QUOTE ]

False. Also the rake is really about half of what it apperas due to bonses and rakeback.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-02-2005, 12:32 PM
2planka 2planka is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 66
Default Re: Why is rake so high, and why isn\'t competition driving it down?

[ QUOTE ]
The rake at the online cardrooms is as high as B&M cardrooms but you get none of the amenities. No waiters, free food, friendly staff, comfy seats, etc.


[/ QUOTE ]

1. Rake is not as high, in my experience. We pay more total rake online because we play way more hands/session.
2. No waiter? get yourself a wife.
3. Free food? move back in with your parents.
4. Friendly staff? get a dog.
5. Comfy seats? get a leather chair or a softer toilet seat.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-02-2005, 12:33 PM
Rudbaeck Rudbaeck is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Sweden
Posts: 555
Default Re: Why is rake so high, and why isn\'t competition driving it down?

[ QUOTE ]
That's the kind of competition Absolute is bringing in at the moment. You get a good chunk of your rake back with their never ending bonuses.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's probably the form the 'war' will take. In a free market you can't maintain the kind of profit margins that the Poker Rooms have.

But a pure underbid doesn't work. So paying back in bonuses, paid-to-play, freerolls, free seats at b&m major events etc is most likely the form it will take.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-02-2005, 12:37 PM
playersare playersare is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 708
Default Re: Why is rake so high, and why isn\'t competition driving it down?

bonuses and rakeback will rebate anywhere from 25% to 200% of your tourney fees depending on the site you play at. if you can't beat the vig at the game you're playing at, then probably best not to play at all. no one is forcing you.

your online vs. B&M argument is irrelevant since you cannot 4-table in a physical cardroom. the "amenity" of online is around the clock availability of games from the comfort of your own home. you can spend the price of one 200+15 and get yourself a nice desk chair.

I'll let others pay rake to fund advertising that brings more fish to the tables. anyone with a little math skill and the ability to use an internet search function will easily find ways to beat the system.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-02-2005, 12:50 PM
sumdumguy sumdumguy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Canada
Posts: 89
Default Re: Why is rake so high, and why isn\'t competition driving it down?

If I 4 table 200+15 SNGs that's $60-75 an hour I'm paying in rake.
Try playing just one.. you'll pay less rake.

..but you get none of the amenities. No waiters, free food, friendly staff, comfy seats, etc.
I too miss the amenities like stinky people, misdeals, pots pushed incorrectly, parking, waiting lists, forced moves. And, I would gladly trade my very comfy $300 chair for a $25 chair all the stinky people sit in, and the coffee machine, mini-fridge, and microwave in my room to toke a waiter every 30 minutes.

I also play online massively multiplayer roleplaying games where they charge $15 a month for unlimited play.
Party has 75K+ players every night. Only the really dumb ones (about 17K) play at the raked tables. The smart ones (the other 60,000!!!!) players play for free. Wake up you dipstick! Check out the FREE tables. Why pay rake when you don't have to!?

What's going on here and why aren't there competing sites doing anything about it?
Go play at GamesGrid.. we'll be waiting for you.

I imagine you could profitably run a site with 1/4 the rake or less, especially if you get massive volume like Party.
I imagine you're wrong.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:32 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.