Folded QQ on the flop

Yeah, the flop being checked behind is an unfortunate and very possible outcome. Though, I still like checking because:

-Should the flop get checked behind, villain would be encouraged to call down with weaker pairs

-Villain, if behind, is drawing close to dead in a smallish pot, and thus a free card isn't detrimental

-I think it allows the hand to be played out in a more straight-forward manner (Hardly a pro for checking, but I'm getting desperate [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img])

I think checking is definitely the way to go if we call preflop (which is a good option, in my opinion). Though I think with the 3-bet pf, betting and checking are very close.

[JJNJustin]

I think so, although there is a reasonable chance your opponent holds any ace, since he raised trying to steal the blinds. However, when playing heads up on the flop, bets and raises dont carry the same meaning as when playing against 3 or more players. By just check folding, you are assuming he holds an ace without any objective evidence. I would have bet out or c/r'ed, or perhaps taken a different approach like passive play on the flop and then bluff raising if a diamond, a three, a deuce, or a pair hit the board. Heads up play is going to lead to more variance, but dont let that discourage you from playing aggressively.

best of luck
-J

[sean c]

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, the flop being checked behind is an unfortunate and very possible outcome. Though, I still like checking because:

-Should the flop get checked behind, villain would be encouraged to call down with weaker pairs

-Villain, if behind, is drawing close to dead in a smallish pot, and thus a free card isn't detrimental

-I think it allows the hand to be played out in a more straight-forward manner (Hardly a pro for checking, but I'm getting desperate [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img])

I think checking is definitely the way to go if we call preflop (which is a good option, in my opinion). Though I think with the 3-bet pf, betting and checking are very close.

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Not 3-betting pre flop would be a pretty big mistake. You would be giving the bb 5:1 to call a raise from a blind steal and giviing up value from the button. This would be a pretty bad time to slow play.

Opps, for some reason I assumed we're BB here. Yeah, allowing BB to look at a cheap flop is a big error. Sorry, misread the read [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

[krimson]

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I'm going to disagree and suggest check/calling. Seems like a clear-cut WA/WB situation to me.

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I don't like this because we 3-bet pre-flop. After announcing our big hand, it's not very likely that we're going to induce weaker hands to bet both the flop and turn. So, the Ace bets each street and we pay him off in full, weaker pairs and hands like KJ get free cards and don't pay us off.

[JoeC1948]

VP$IP 22%
PreFlop raise 8%
Post plop AF 4

I agree that I should have bet out after the flop. I had just had a bad beat and was gunshy. Thanks for all the input

[ QUOTE ]
VP$IP 22%
PreFlop raise 8%
Post plop AF 4

I agree that I should have bet out after the flop. I had just had a bad beat and was gunshy. Thanks for all the input

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Definitely especially with a guy that has a VPIP that high and an aggression factor that high. This guy is betting/raising light all the time.

[callmedonnie]

A good player with J10o on a steal will bet the flop when checked to 100% of the time. So this all hinges on what kind of player the button is, and I personally think against most this is pretty soft play.

[callmedonnie]

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While the general consensus seems to be to bet out the flop, I'm going to disagree and suggest check/calling. Seems like a clear-cut WA/WB situation to me. If he doesn't have an A, he is likely drawing to ~3 or less outs. Therefore, we should encourage villain to play incorrectly and bet out his weak hands. This also allows us to minimize losses when we are behind. My overall line here would be: c/c flop c/c turn and b/f the river.

I think betting the turn is superior if a 3rd [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] falls, to try to knock a weak [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] and to avoid giving a free card.

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I think 3 betting preflop and then checking the flop is horrible in general (barring certain circumstances), HU it is even worse than usual. If you lead and are raised, you can call for two and depending on opponent go from there. On turn I would c/f to a weak tight, I would prob b/f to a TAG. I think I use WA/WB only to a maniac. Anwyway, wa/wb amounts to 2.5 bets if we bet and are called on every street. The other two options I mention cost 1 and 2 bets. There is no showdown, but that is why reading people makes us money.