KK unimproved, facing a push and a call

[thatpfunk]

practicing hand reading might be a good idea. you think someone with either 2 pair or a set smoothcalled this flop after a bet (possible) and then smoothcalled again after it had been raised by a maniac and called (not that likely). AND THEN after all that trickiness he open pushed the turn facing a nearly guaranteed bet w/ the great possibility of trapping the SB AFTER he filled up and is no longer worried about draws (completely absurd).

but you have 100k hands, sorry. ill just keep gambling.

[Isura]

[ QUOTE ]

Pusher (MP) is not crazy, just average bad. Overcaller (CO) is absolutely horrible (90/44) preflop, postflop, hell hes bad at sitting at the table.

[/ QUOTE ]

If both players are that bad, you made a pretty big mistake by not reraising preflop.

[thatpfunk]

[ QUOTE ]


Why the pissy mood? Nothing in this hand is interesting. If you're going to play KK this way on the early streets, the turn is an instacall. Your hand basically plays like bottom set here. If you'd call with bottom set (and I'm about 100% certain you would), you call with KK.

[/ QUOTE ]

how can this hand be completely uninteresting yet every response in the thread disagrees with every decision? somewhat contradictory, no?

pissy? i dunno. i just get annoyed in this forum because i only post hands that i play differently (maybe thats the problem since they are often based on table context) and every response is "OMG you need to do X" w/ X=standard play.

[4_2_it]

[ QUOTE ]
practicing hand reading might be a good idea. you think someone with either 2 pair or a set smoothcalled this flop after a bet (possible) and then smoothcalled again after it had been raised by a maniac and called (not that likely). AND THEN after all that trickiness he open pushed the turn facing a nearly guaranteed bet w/ the great possibility of trapping the SB AFTER he filled up and is no longer worried about draws (completely absurd).

but you have 100k hands, sorry. ill just keep gambling.

[/ QUOTE ]

CO was the pre-flop raiser, raised the flop then called a turn push from an idiot. How is it impossible to think he doesn't have KK beat most of the time????

Again, congratulations on the hand. Folding would have been a huge mistake. If you ask for comments and someone provides you with constructive criticism either say thanks or make a logical counter argument. Insults are childish.

[thatpfunk]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Pusher (MP) is not crazy, just average bad. Overcaller (CO) is absolutely horrible (90/44) preflop, postflop, hell hes bad at sitting at the table.

[/ QUOTE ]

If both players are that bad, you made a pretty big mistake by not reraising preflop.

[/ QUOTE ]

maybe its just me, but i win next to zero big pots after putting in a 2nd raise pf (unless it happens to be AA v KK and we know a 40pfr's range is way bigger than simply big pps). even maniacs know that a reraise = a big hand in this game. the majority of the time i reraise in this situation i lead the flop and its folded. is the deception worth the risk? i dont mind it and am perfectly comfortable with it.

once again, maybe its just me.

[4_2_it]

[ QUOTE ]
i just get annoyed in this forum because i only post hands that i play differently (maybe thats the problem since they are often based on table context) and every response is "OMG you need to do X" w/ X=standard play.

[/ QUOTE ]

Without specific reads or giving us your plan of attack how do expect to get anything other than ABC advice? Limping AA or KK is fine if you have a reason and a plan. Your OP stated nothing specific so everyone assumed (wrongly) that you had no plan.

[Ghazban]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]


Why the pissy mood? Nothing in this hand is interesting. If you're going to play KK this way on the early streets, the turn is an instacall. Your hand basically plays like bottom set here. If you'd call with bottom set (and I'm about 100% certain you would), you call with KK.

[/ QUOTE ]

how can this hand be completely uninteresting yet every response in the thread disagrees with every decision? somewhat contradictory, no?

pissy? i dunno. i just get annoyed in this forum because i only post hands that i play differently (maybe thats the problem since they are often based on table context) and every response is "OMG you need to do X" w/ X=standard play.

[/ QUOTE ]

You tell me what's interesting about it then. You're irritated that people are focused on the preflop and flop play. That's the part that's nonstandard (which some might equate with interest?). On a T424 board where I haven't let anybody know I have a hand as strong as KK and I'm against horrible players, I'm more than happy to get both all in against both of them expecting an overpair from one and TPGK from the other. Yes, you'll run into AA and/or a set sometimes but big deal; most of the time you don't.

[GrunchCan]

So did you post this hand becasue you wanted advice or feedback? If you're unwilling to acccept the possibility that "unorthodox" does not necesarrily mean "advanced but correct" and that you misplayed this hand, then why ask for feedback that you won't accept?

If you didn't post this becasue you wanted advice, then why didn't you put "no content" in the title?

[thatpfunk]

[ QUOTE ]

CO was the pre-flop raiser, raised the flop then called a turn push from an idiot. How is it impossible to think he doesn't have KK beat most of the time????

[/ QUOTE ]

are you freaking serious? he raises 44% of the time. that is half of his hands. i am worried about being behind a tiny fraction of hands. he raised the flop after a weak lead/stab, his range is still gigantic (not to mention the fact that when the board pairs and i am now ahead of the times he flopped a random 2pr). there is a WAY higher percentage of hands that i am ahead of than behind.

[thatpfunk]

it was posted because i was chatting with someone and they said they would never make the turn call and i thought it was kind of automatic.

also, i shouldn't have said that i find the flop play completely uninteresting, that was a mistake. i think CRing rather than leading is pretty viable as is pushing after the maniac raises (although i dont think i get paid as often w/ either of those)