Take the leap from hold'em to stud?

[Askilus]

Hi,

To broaden my poker skills a little I've been wondering if I should make a leap to seven card stud a while and try it out. So far I've been playing micro limit hold'em only. Do you guys think that this would be good for my poker skills or am I doomed to get real confused? [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I have a decent grasp on general gambling concepts like expectation, pot odds, implied odds, varience etc. etc. but I don't know stud at all.

Are there any fishes at the lower stud games or are they all playing hold'em?

And finally, if I deside to try it out, which books do you recommend? I already have TOP for the general concepts so what I need is something specificly on stud. Is "Seven Card Stud for Advanced Players" sufficient or do a need more? For hold'em I used WLLH before I moved on to SSH and HFAP. Are there any thing like WLLH for stud (that is, a GOOD and accurate beginners book)?

[Sluss]

I'm about halfway through 7CSFAP right now. Some great loose game advice. I've found Chip Reese's chapter on Stud in Supersystem very helpful in lower limit games. Not the ante stealing and more advanced plays but the straight ABC's are covered very well and can be very profitable in lower limit games.

[MRBAA]

low stud is just as fishy as low he -- and a good player arguably has more edge since he can remember up cards. I'd recommend getting up to $2-4 online (or $4-8 live) at one game before learning another. But learning other games is great for overall understanding of poker, keeping the game fresh and fun longterm and -- if you're serious about making money -- it's also an important part of maximizing your money making potential, by being able to take advantage of the best (fishiest) game around. I started with stud, learned he and currently enjoy them both about the same.

[bigmac366]

in my expierence playing stud at party, it is even fishier than holdem. 3/6 and lower on party plays like a joke. a good beginners book is roy west's book. i have 7cs4ap but havent had time to read it yet(focusing on my limit he game), but andy b loves it so i'm sure its excellent. also if you play on party and have the bankroll, stay out of the .5/1 game. it is rediciously overanted. hope this helps

[babigm]

I think it's a good idea, at least eventually. It might be too early if you're still playing microlimits. I found the transition from Holdem to Stud to be relatively easy, it was a lot easier to learn then Omaha, which is what most people pick as their "next" game. Also, while the player base is much smaller, they also seem to be less well informed. A lot of people playing it are just trying it out because they're bored of their usual game.

I learned Stud by playing in some freeroll stud tourneys at Absolute Poker. Other places may have them too, but they're a lot more rare then holdem or omaha freerolls. I tried play money at a few places, but I found it worthless, you can't learn anything if the betting is capped every round. The freeroll is nice because while it doesn't play exactly like real money or ring games, there are still a good chunk of players, especially after the first half-hour, that treat it seriously and competitively. It's a good way to get into the feel of the game, see what kind of hands win pots in a realistic setting, get used to the kind of money and betting involved in a single round, and start seeing what's similar or different between holdem and stud, and how strategies in one can be modified to work in the other.

I learned a lot in my second freeroll tourney going heads-up against this other player (everyone else was absent or sitting out). I saw really quick the psychology behind certain moves and reading other people's "flops" (one way to think about it if you're transitioning). Also this was my "lucky" day, where I got rolled up K's twice and rolled up A's once all during one tourney...and I won exactly one of them. Didn't realize how rare it was to get something like that then...

[Andy B]

I don't love 7CS4AP, but it is the best stud book out there, and you can't afford not to read it if you're going to play this game. I really wish that Mason would hire a real editor and fix some of the more glaring grammatical errors.

Some will suggest this or that "beginners" book. West is a popular suggestion, and I think most regular readers of this forum have gotten the idea that I don't care for that one. Since Askilus is an experienced poker player and has read several poker books including TOP, I see no reason at all why he shouldn't dive straight into 7CS4AP.

[Cooker]

I think stud or Omaha/8 are the best low limit games to play. I have been a winner from the very beginning playing these games at the lower limits. I am still not very advanced at either, but just knowing what you are looking for in starting hands helps a lot.

The reason these games are so nice is that there are so many fishy players that think Stud and Omaha hands that contain good holdem hands are good hands in those games which they aren't unless well complimented by the other starting cards.

I would guess that a person could simply read the starting hand sections of 7CSFAP and the Ray Zee book and be an immediate winner in the lowest games at every site. That being said, I notice my win rate is growing nicely as I add in more techniques from the books mentioned above.

I would recommend Omaha/8 for a nice change of pace since the action is great and the swings are not so bad. Stud seems to have some pretty wild swings. Of course this could just be that I try more "fancy" plays in stud (and probably more than I should) than in Omaha/8.