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  #1  
Old 10-26-2005, 03:05 PM
Bartholow Bartholow is offline
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Location: Cleveland, OH
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Default $20/$40 high: two reasonably large pots without showdown

Game was playing very aggressive, lots of reraising on 3rd, don't have great reads on the players involved, but I was pretty sure seats 7 and 8 were both mediocre. These hands happened in this order, 2 or 3 hands in between.

Let me know if I'm nuts or not.

7 Card Stud High ($20/$40), Ante $2, Bring-In $5 (converter)

3rd Street - (0.80 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___brings-in___folds
Seat 2: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 3: xx xx 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 4: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___folds
Hero: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___completes
Seat 6: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 7: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 8: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls

4th Street - (3.05 SB)

Hero: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___bets___raises
Seat 8: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___raises___calls

5th Street - (4.53 BB)

Hero: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___bets___calls
Seat 8: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___raises

6th Street - (8.53 BB)

Hero: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___bets
Seat 8: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___calls

River - (10.53 BB)

Hero: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___bets
Seat 8: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] xx___folds

Total pot: (10.53 BB)

7 Card Stud High ($20/$40), Ante $2, Bring-In $5 (converter)

3rd Street - (0.80 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls___folds
Seat 2: xx xx 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 3: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 4: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Hero: 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls___calls
Seat 6: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___completes___calls
Seat 7: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___raises
Seat 8: xx xx 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___brings-in___folds

4th Street - (7.30 SB)

Hero: 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 6: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 7: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___bets

5th Street - (5.15 BB)

Hero: 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___bets
Seat 6: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 7: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls

6th Street - (7.15 BB)

Hero: 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___raises
Seat 7: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___bets___calls

River - (11.15 BB)

Hero: 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___bets
Seat 7: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] xx___checks___folds

Total pot: (11.15 BB)
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  #2  
Old 10-26-2005, 03:15 PM
frappeboy frappeboy is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 132
Default Re: $20/$40 high: two reasonably large pots without showdown

[ QUOTE ]
Let me know if I'm nuts or not.


[/ QUOTE ]

I think you are, but that's just me.

I like raising 3rd on hand 1, the follow up bet on 4th street is ok but you have to give it up when he raises 4th.

Hand 2 is clearly a mistake calling a double bet in the tightest ante structured game on partypoker. In fact, you should still fold in a loose ante structure. The spades are dead and so are your straight possiblities, and you are sure you are behind at this point. To top it all off you have a position disadvantage since the first raiser may re-raise.
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  #3  
Old 10-26-2005, 03:36 PM
beta1607 beta1607 is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 101
Default Re: $20/$40 high: two reasonably large pots without showdown

What was your thought process on 4th and 5th street in the first hand. I would never three bet there, and would probably just but I kind of like your agression(maybe I am being results oriented?).
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  #4  
Old 10-26-2005, 04:13 PM
blumpkin22 blumpkin22 is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 32
Default Re: $20/$40 high: two reasonably large pots without showdown

Hand 1:
Fold third. Yes, you have an ace and everyone's cards are dead, but so are yours. You don't have to ante-steal every time you have an ace. What makes it playable is the live kings and jacks.

After third, you are simply spewing. You were getting called down if you didn't make an open pair. Basically, you got lucky. Of course, after the foolish aggression on fourth, when you pick up the king you are seeing the river, so you might as well play it the same from fifth on.

Hand 2:
For fu[/i]ck sake, fold third. If your kicker was an ace that was just as live I'd probably play it the same. Congrats on getting paid off to some extend after pairing your door.
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  #5  
Old 10-26-2005, 07:07 PM
preiserone preiserone is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Milwaukee Wisconsin
Posts: 23
Default Re: $20/$40 high: two reasonably large pots without showdown

I don't play in aggressive 20-40 games so this is not at all how I would play these, but under those circumstances I like the sort of scare card bluffs into dead hands, these guys could not have much, and that much aggression is going to make me run away when i'm sitting on a pair or busted draw.
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  #6  
Old 10-26-2005, 09:03 PM
Andy B Andy B is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Twin Cities
Posts: 1,245
Default Re: $20/$40 high: two reasonably large pots without showdown

Hand 1: I think that completing on third street is the way to go, mostly because the cards behind you are either small or dead. I think betting on fourth was fine, but you should probably have folded to the raise. Maybe you call here and fold fifth if you don't buy any help, but with one of your cards completely dead, I think folding on fourth is better. I'm glad all this aggression paid off for you, and you might make a note that it works against this player, but I think most players are going to look you up most of the time.

Hand 2: limping on third street was fine, but calling when it was $35 to you was pretty silly. I do like how you played the rest of the hand.
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  #7  
Old 10-27-2005, 05:55 AM
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Default Re: $20/$40 high: two reasonably large pots without showdown

Okay, don't be too horrible with how wrong I am...

With hand 1, I think that completing is fine. The cards behind you are dead, even more so than your opponents know. However, I think when you get called here, you have to wonder what he is calling with. I know you said the game is aggressive, but he has only invested his ante thus far, and chose to call a whole bet for some reason.

On 4th, you betting out is kind of 50/50 to portraying that you were not stealing but trying to play a hand. I do not think him raising you here means a whole lot. It is a cheap street and he could be looking for cheap information. I can understand your motivations for reraising here, as it leaves you in charge of the hand. It allows you to lead 5th with more integration to your line.

You catch the big card and bet out. His raise on 5th worries me a bit more. He knows two diamonds are dead, but maybe he picked up the flush draw. If he picked up the straight draw, then he is very lucky given how dead it looked on 3rd. However, it could be a free card play or semi-bluff if he did pick up either draw and decide to run with it.

I do not know, I think he was racing you to something-up. He calls sixth because he has picked up the four flush and/or possibly to try to hit trips if he has a live, buried pair. He did not realise that you did not have the "something" in the first place.

I think your play portrays a premium hand pretty well. I also think you are lucky that he decided not to check up on the river as he missed.

I would not say you are nuts, just that I do not think I could play this aggressively to portray a holding. Provided he has not got As or Ks in the hole, and I was right about his holding - you might have won if you hit a live A or K. So, I guess you could consider some of the bets semi-bluffs. I just do not like going for this with one T and *three* Qs down on 3rd. The open 8s saved the day.

With hand 2, I think I would fold to the double raise. There's a bunch of your straightening cards dead, a bunch of your two-flush cards dead. You don't have many ways to improve to beat what looks like at least one, if not two big hands. I do not think I could play here...

Given that I did, I think I like calling 4th given you now have a lively K and you have not seen any 8s or 7s die.

5th is a nice catch, I think the 8s like you. From there on out I am fine with the hand. I do not think I could play the rest of the hand this well, let alone better. I do not know if you might have got more bets with calling 6th and raising 7th, but that's neither here nor there - I guess.
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