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#121
11-22-2004, 07:57 PM
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Re: Artest gone for year, other suspensions absurdly long
[ QUOTE ]
Artest for year. Jackson for 30 games. O'Neil for 25 games. Wallace for 6 games. Pretty absurd. [/ QUOTE ] I think it's just about right...hit 'em in the wallet, where it hurts. Besides, now Artest has all the time he needs to work on his music. 
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#122
11-23-2004, 12:16 AM
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Re: Artest gone for year, other suspensions absurdly long
[ QUOTE ]
Tell you what. Get into a fight with customers at YOUR work,(Mirage?)cause a near-riot, and see if you still have a job and don't go to jail, much less only get suspended for an extended period of time. Artest was not "assualted" by fans. An EMPTY plastic cup hit him on/around his upper chest/chin area, and he lost it. O'Neal was not "protecting" Artest. He was taking a cheap shot at a guy who was getting up from a scrum. Get a clue, some perspective, and a reality check. The 40-80 game has warped your sensibilities. [/ QUOTE ] Tell you what. Find me customers who come into anyone's place of work, who can call you a M-F'er, a N-er, degrade your family, your persona, curse and swear at you without repercussion and apparently can throw objects at you as well. Oh, wait. There is no such place other than pro sports. The idea that the fans can do whatever they want simply because they pay for a ticket has gone way overboard. The fans need a reality check, and all sports leagues need to start thinking a lot more about what they allow the fans to get away with. This carte blanche mentality has got to go. If you seriously think the fans are blameless in this, then I really think you have utterly lost the ability to look at this fairly from both sides.
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#123
11-23-2004, 12:29 AM
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Re: Artest gone for year, other suspensions absurdly long
[ QUOTE ]
The idea that the fans can do whatever they want simply because they pay for a ticket has gone way overboard. The fans need a reality check, and all sports leagues need to start thinking a lot more about what they allow the fans to get away with. This carte blanche mentality has got to go. If you seriously think the fans are blameless in this, then I really think you have utterly lost the ability to look at this fairly from both sides. [/ QUOTE ] I've stayed out of this fray so far (pun intended), but I have to butt in and say that I agree with this 100%. Good post.
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#124
11-23-2004, 12:38 AM
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Re: Artest gone for year, other suspensions absurdly long
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] The idea that the fans can do whatever they want simply because they pay for a ticket has gone way overboard. The fans need a reality check, and all sports leagues need to start thinking a lot more about what they allow the fans to get away with. This carte blanche mentality has got to go. If you seriously think the fans are blameless in this, then I really think you have utterly lost the ability to look at this fairly from both sides. [/ QUOTE ] I've stayed out of this fray so far (pun intended), but I have to butt in and say that I agree with this 100%. Good post. [/ QUOTE ] I second this - Clark, you're a class act who obviously gets what's going on here. Thanks for posting so clearly and succinctly about how this thing is actually going down. My Pacers avatar apparently turned everyone off from listening to me. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] Maybe the new one will help? -Edge
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#125
11-23-2004, 01:23 AM
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Re: Artest gone for year, other suspensions absurdly long
I can empathize with your frustration with the fans but when the players cross the line they have the commissioner to deal with. And their is a line whether you like it or not. It's part of their agreement. Perhaps in the next collective bargaining agreement go round the players can negotiate something about the fans that doesn't exist now. It seems that your point is far too lenient with the fans. You wrote:
[ QUOTE ] Tell you what. Find me customers who come into anyone's place of work, who can call you a M-F'er, a N-er, degrade your family, your persona, curse and swear at you without repercussion and apparently can throw objects at you as well. [/ QUOTE ] Are you saying that a fan cannot be removed for exhibiting this behavior? Also I'm certain that there are many who gladly trade places with NBA players and collect the salaries that these guys make and deal with these problems. Put me on that list as one. Second of all how can you be so absolutely sure there will be no repercussions to the fans involved in this incident. If there are repercussions such as criminal charges and subsequent prosecutions as well as action taken by the Pistons organization what will you say then? Methinks your being at least slightly impatient and jumping to conclusions.
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#126
11-23-2004, 01:36 AM
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Re: Artest gone for year, other suspensions absurdly long
"Are you saying that a fan cannot be removed for exhibiting this behavior?"
I'm saying they are not. At least not very often. Unless they are rooting against the home team, that is. "If there are repercussions such as criminal charges and subsequent prosecutions as well as action taken by the Pistons organization what will you say then? Methinks your being at least slightly impatient and jumping to conclusions. " C'mon. You know that's not going to happen. As has been mentioned countless times, those two who premeditatedly attacked Tom Gamboa in Chicago last year didn't even do jail time. There are no real repercussions for the fans, except the reward of knowing that they helped their team out by taking actions that ultimately led to the crippling of their rival's chances and dramatically improved their favorite team's chances of winning a NBA title.
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#128
11-23-2004, 03:14 AM
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Re: Artest gone for year, other suspensions absurdly long
"they helped their team out by taking actions that ultimately led to the crippling of their rival's chances and dramatically improved their favorite team's chances of winning a NBA title."
I can't understand this. If Artest points out the cup thrower (which, of course, he couldn't have, since he didn't see it; but the guy could certainly have been identified by others) nothing happens. The only people who tooks actions that led to the crippling of their team were the Pacers who decided to go into the stands because one guy threw a cup. You might just as well say that if a guy I beat at poker wasn't able to pay his rent I was responsible for taking actions that led to the guy being thrown out onto the street. Whatever happened to personal responsibility for one's actions?
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#129
11-23-2004, 03:16 AM
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Re: Artest gone for year, other suspensions absurdly long
[ QUOTE ]
You might just as well say that if a guy I beat at poker wasn't able to pay his rent I was responsible for taking actions that led to the guy being thrown out onto the street. Whatever happened to personal responsibility for one's actions? [/ QUOTE ] This is the crucial point, and Andy states it very well. [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
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#130
11-23-2004, 03:25 AM
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Re: Artest gone for year, other suspensions absurdly long
Disagree.
What this ruling says is: "Hey fans, keep being obnoxious. Continue to verbally abuse players to no end, harass them, heck, even throw things at them. You may get lucky enough to incite an opposing player to the point where he gets himself suspended. You can be a hero to your team!" Wonderful.
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