Different line vs TAG

ArturiusX · #1 11-22-2005, 11:04 PM

This guys a 27/19, probably a 2p2er, seems solid. Who likes this?

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP with J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
1 fold, Hero raises, 2 folds, BB 3-bets, Hero caps, BB calls.

Flop: (8.40 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets, Hero calls.

Turn: (5.20 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets, Hero raises, BB calls.

River: (9.20 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks.

Final Pot: 9.20 BB

Stefan_K · #2 11-22-2005, 11:34 PM

fold the flop or occasionally rais the flop, or if you feel parranoid you may check call the whole way. but fold flop is standard

jph0424 · #3 11-22-2005, 11:35 PM

If you are determined to get to show down then why not raise flop, Check behind on turn, and call river or raise flop, bet turn (fold to a CR), and check behind on river. These would each save you 1 sb because I think you are behind most of the time. I just do not know what a solid TAG donkbets you with on that flop after you cap that you beat.

I probably raise flop and that is the last money I put into the pot in case he is taking a shot at me. If he calls this flop raise I feel ok folding even after I induce the river bluff by checking behind on turn.

ArturiusX · #4 11-22-2005, 11:37 PM

Im raising for folding equity.

jph0424 · #5 11-22-2005, 11:44 PM

OK lets think about hands that would donkbet the flop after 3 betting pf when A23 rainbow flops. You said he is 27/19 and he 3 bet your MP raise from the BB. This to me means he has 99-AA AQ,AK, and maybe AJs or KQs. After you cap preflop I think the only hands he donks this flop with are AK, AQ, AJs, maybe AA-QQ. The only hands of these that would fold to a TAG's turn raise are MAYBE KK and QQ. The more I think about it the more I like just folding the flop. I also do not think you have that much more fold equity from raising the turn here as opposed to raising the flop.

Mathieu · #6 11-23-2005, 12:08 AM

I don't know how this game plays so take my advice with a grain of salt...

Anyways I don't like the flop raise because I think all the better hands that you have Fold equity against would be likely to play it wa/wb here. Maybe I'm wrong about that.

I think if he is betting, he either he has you crushed and wants to play a big pot, or is taking a stab at it with a medium pair hoping you will fold a bigger pocket pair.

I only like the flop raise if you think that this guy would lead out with under pairs including QQ & KK, and fold them to a raise. Otherwise I prefer calling or folding. I think we need this guy to be extremely straight forward for folding to be correct though.

ArturiusX · #7 11-23-2005, 12:27 AM

His range might be slighlty bigger, he seems aggressive towards me and my blind steals.

jph0424 · #8 11-23-2005, 12:30 AM

But if you are MP it isn't really a steal situation. Even if you broaden his range what additional hands would you include that play the hand this way that you have turn fold equity on?

ArturiusX · #9 11-23-2005, 12:41 AM

Out of curosity, what would you do with KK/QQ if you played it from the villians perspective?

jph0424 · #10 11-23-2005, 12:45 AM

Well if I did donk the flop and turn I would probably fold to the turn raise but I would not donk flop and turn. This is a WA/WB situation for my hand and I would probably check/call down as a default.