The Nuts... now what?

@buzz: thats kinda where i wanted to go..
@bozlax: cant tell you about that thread, didnt try search

(edit: the @'s)

[shant]

Seriously, this pause tell thing is retarded. Do you find yourself getting checkraised when you get up to get a drink of water, or if your connection lags? I know I always get raised after I take a few seconds too long looking at action on another table. Last night while I was looking for something else to watch on TV, someone check 3-bet me on the river.

Time based tells are stupid. Do you think this guy would've checkraised you with a lower flush or with a set because you paused?

He was check/calling for runner runner, hit and got cute. If he was actually paying attention to anything he'd have folded to the 3-bet because at that point what does he beat? Unless of course you paused again.

Well, all i noticed during play was that when i changed the pace of the betting/calling, he changed his action. You might be right he is chasing his flush, but on the other hand, at micro, how often is QQ laid down...So yes, i think my pausing at least put some doubt on him, as buzz-cp said.

[bozlax]

[ QUOTE ]
Well, all i noticed during play was that when i changed the pace of the betting/calling, he changed his action. You might be right he is chasing his flush, but on the other hand, at micro, how often is QQ laid down...So yes, i think my pausing at least put some doubt on him, as buzz-cp said.

[/ QUOTE ]

How do you know? In order to make this statement, you'd have to know what he was GOING to do vs. what he DID do. (Edit: and in order to be able to get that read online, you'd have to have thousands of hands on Villan, that'd you'd studied with a microscope. Live at least you might see him going back for extra chips or something.)

And, you're right, QQ isn't going to get laid down in micros...for him the backdoor flush draw was just a bonus. And the 2nd (ok, 3rd, but I bet your Villan didn't notice the sf any more than you did) nut flush is going to be raised on the river about 100% of the time...maybe more.

Shant is right...timing-based tells are garbage. Me scratching my nuts before I bet/call may be a tell, but it's not because of the time it take me; I just want to make sure they're still there when I'm considering raising 3rd pair on the river.

Let me restate I was still speculating, and that is why I suggest he ask the dude why he checkraised.

Well I guess indeed with the multitabling, ballscratching and all there are just too much random delays to really base anything on timing.

Thanks for sharing your views.

[bozlax]

[ QUOTE ]
Let me restate I was still speculating, and that is why I suggest he ask the dude why he checkraised.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, and with all due respect, I think this is an even stupider idea than waiting to bet because you think it'll change your opponent's action. Either he tells you, confirming something you already had a read on (he's not a very good player), he surprises you with something ("my cat told me to"), in which case he's probably lying, or he says, "Who check-whatted where?" (which would be my response). Don't talk about strategy at any table that's not a 2+2 table set up for the purpose...it's -EV.

point taken, Boz

I think your move was pretty cool. Im going to use it today.

after all the previous comments im not sure with how much sarcasm im dealing [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]