What THREE books would you recommend to a brand new player....

[Clarkmeister]

"cheater"

Oh well. I figure anyone so tight with money that they won't buy the 2 more books (and its not like I expect them to buy all 5 at once) doesn't have enough gamble in them to win at holdem anyways. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Blarg]

Theory of Poker is not a first-time poker book. It takes some serious study, the writing is dense and not terribly user-friendly, and a lot of the concepts would fly over the head of a brand new player. Additionally, it uses examples from many different types of poker, which would be confusing to someone who may not even know the rules to one type of poker all that well. HEPFAP is an even worse book for a beginner by far.

1. Internet Texas Hold'em -- probably the best all around hold'em book. Extremely clear, balanced, and concise, and its material will take you well past the lower limits.

Take some time off and play before reading anything else.

2. Theory of Poker -- Now you're ready to digest something like this. Less will go over your head and be lost, or just be confusing.

3. Small Stakes Hold'em by Miller. The easiest of these books by far to misunderstand and get in a whole lot of trouble by not applying correctly. Ed himself says it's not a first book, and he's 100% correct. The concepts are necessary for players of any level of stakes to understand. A great way to open up your game and expand your profitability.

You could mix and match the order of 2 and 3 or even read them at the same time.

Eventually, HEPFAP can come in as a very distant 4th. But there's no reason to jump into your doctorate when you still need to be working on your undergraduate core curricula, and those three books will give anyone an awful lot to think about and try out in practice for a very long time.

[BarronVangorToth]

[ QUOTE ]
"cheater"

Oh well. I figure anyone so tight with money that they won't buy the 2 more books (and its not like I expect them to buy all 5 at once) doesn't have enough gamble in them to win at holdem anyways. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]


First, thanks to everyone (including you) for the replies thusfar... I probably will be doing some semblance of a modification to my recommendations and the order. With that said, as to the "three" bit -- as I noted above, I have WAY too many books and WAY too many poker books. My buddy, upon seeing this, did NOT want me recommending everything ... yet, still, even from the horrendous books (of which most are) I was like, This chapter is good from this book, this is good from that one, etc etc...

...and he was overwhelmed.

"Three books, Barron," he said. "Just three. Exactly three. Just three."

So ... three it is.

For now, at least.

Barron Vangor Toth
www.BarronVangorToth.com

[chson]

It's written poorly making the information difficult to digest. Being clear and thorough should be first priority in any instructional text. Also, some of the chapters are flat-out incorrect. For example, various discussions have proven that the Loose Games chapter teaches techniques that'll hinder your play in loose games. The authors reluctantly agree but respond by stating that the loose games they're specifically addressing have to meet several other requirements. Unfortunately these other requirements (good post-flop players, etc.) are not mentioned anywhere in the book! Essentially anyone who reads the Loose Games chapter without reading these forums will be using the techniques incorrectly. At some point you have to wonder what other chapters in the book require adjustments that are only mentioned on this internet forum.

[mistrpug]

[ QUOTE ]
I have many friends learning how to play. I currently have them on a 5-book rotation.

1. WLLH - Jones
2. TOP - Sklansky
3. Middle Limit Holdem - Brier and Ciaffone
4. Small Stakes Holdem - Eddie et al.
5. HPFAP - Sklansky & Malmuth

I am *very* comfortable with this progression.

[/ QUOTE ]

I find it interesting that you recommend Middle Limit Holdem before Small Stakes Holdem. May I ask what your reasonong behind this is? You would think it would be the opposite.

[Jman28]

.

[Dr. Shrinker]

1. WLLH by Jones

2. ITH by Hilger

3. SSHE by Miller et al

My 2¢

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
I find it interesting that you recommend Middle Limit Holdem before Small Stakes Holdem. May I ask what your reasonong behind this is? You would think it would be the opposite.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think SSH is a more advanced book conceptually than MLH.

In an oversimplified nutshell, I think it is important to have a strong overall strategic approach to the game as a foundation. Despite their respective flaws, WLLH offers a great strategic approach to the game for beginners and MLH is the perfect natural extension of that.

SSH and HPFAP meanwhile are IMO more tactical in nature. I feel most players need to focus on a fundamental strategic approach to the game before worrying about more sophisticated tactical maneuvers that they don't necessarily understand or correctly apply.

Essentially, I think it is good for players to begin with a somewhat weak-tightish mindset that then grows into a more sophisticated attacking strategy. Most newer players have a natural tendency to be loose and aggressive. WLLH followed by MLH should help hammer home a nice weak tight mindset and overall strategy that can then begin to "plug in" the more advanced tactical ideas contained in SSH and HPFAP.

I add TOP in after WLLH because the ideas involved there are too important to overlook once someone has played a few hours and read that initial book. I don't expect my friends to "get" TOP fully that soon in their poker career, but it forces them to look at poker in a dry analytical manner instead of in a "the game is about psyching out your opponents, bluffing and making reads" manner.

Hope this makes sense.

[bonanz]

[ QUOTE ]
Hope this makes sense.

[/ QUOTE ]

makes perfect sense. and clarkmeisters 5 books and order to read them is the absolute best "curriculum" I have seen laid out. I knew there was a good order to read specific books for beginning players who have someone to give them pointers and this is it. I've never really ptu much thought into it because i've just read books in whatever order I learned of them.

this is why clarkmeister pwns these boards lol.

And I absolutely agree about learning to be weak tight first. If you have absolutely no idea what you are doing, wllh, if nothing else, teaches you how to fold. then the fat dose of what poker is all about with top. then the more advanced (arguably weak tight) MLH helps you learn how to think through hands. By this point you should be solid but probably slightly on the passive side. but ssh steps in and changes all of that. then hpfap comes in last to round out your limit holdem game with some of the most advanced strategic concepts in holdem that are necessary for higher level of thinking and tougher opponents.

If you don't know anything about holdem and want to learn, this is probably the best list of reading in order I ever seen laid out. There are numerous posts about peoples favorite books, or top 10's or whatever. but i think this is the definitive list for limit holdem. Any book you read after that will only make you a stronger beast.

bonanz

ps. i have seen many people recommend ITH by hilger as a sort of replacement for WLLH. I have never read this and cannot speak about it, but am curious about anyone who has read it and how they feel about it compared to WLLH as an aspiring players first book.

[John White]

If you're really forcing only three books, and the five book rotation is out the window?

I'd say:

HEPFAP
ITPM
SSHE

This is backdoor cheating, as I'd use the preflop discussion from HEPFAP as one book during that beginning period and the rest as he becomes more experienced. SSHE's discussion of post-flop play is more cogent than HEPFAP's. I like TOP, but it's a lot of theory. I want to read a paper with a title like "Applied Game Theory in Hold 'Em," not short pieces on how cool game theory is without enough examples... By the time anyone need to read TOP, they won't worry about three book limits.