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  #1  
Old 11-03-2005, 12:37 PM
elmitchbo elmitchbo is offline
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Default At 2.5x the buy-in i turn into a donk....help me figure out why

i've been playing alot of small stakes 6 max NL lately. i feel like my natural style of play works pretty well there, but for quite some time now i've been having a problem.

every time i get up to about 2 or 2.5x the max buy-in something happens to my game and i donk off everything i've made(and then some occasionally). it's very rare for me to sit down and just lose my stack. 9 out of 10 times i build my stack once i get into the game and get a feel for the table. for that reason i think it's not simply a matter of playing in a game that i can't beat. i feel lilke i can always get ahead, but once i get some chips things start to go bad.

i have a few theories...

1. when i get some extra chips i start to play poorly. this would be the most obvouis problem. i don't really feel like anything changes in my game, but it is certainly possible that i start making calls or plays that i wouldn't have made with my starting buy in. i don't really think this is the problem, but that might be wishful thinking on my part.

2. people figure me out, and i fail to switch gears. often times it seems that as my stack grows a bit the other payers catch on to what i'm doing and adjust for it. so i actually am playing the same as i was with my starting stack... it's just starting to back fire.

3. the time frame is always about the same. i wonder if i just get to a point where i lose some focus and start playing poorly just because i'm tired or bored.

i think all 3 are possible, and it might be a combination of them all. i've been trying to self analyze, but i can't figure out which of the scenarios i listed is the real problem. i know i should stay in a game if it's profitable, but i'm starting to think i should get up every time i get ahead. then i could take a litle break and sit back down with a regular buy-in.

does any one else have the same problem.... play well and accumulate some chips and then donk it all of in no time? any suggestion on what to try?
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  #2  
Old 11-03-2005, 12:55 PM
soko soko is offline
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Default Re: At 2.5x the buy-in i turn into a donk....help me figure out why

A simple reply would be to keep reminding yourself to get a feel for the table, if your making money then people must be losing it, the people who just doubled you up may have busted out and before you know it 50% of the people have been replaced at the table all haveing different playing styles than the people who gave their money to you.

Then agian, it could just be bad luck, and/or selective memory, just because you doubled up doesn't mean it's impossible to have a bad run of cards within the next few hundred hands.

Stop looking for patterns in your game and just concentrate on the game itself.
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  #3  
Old 11-03-2005, 08:11 PM
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Default Re: At 2.5x the buy-in i turn into a donk....help me figure out why

I do the exact same thing, full ring game, no-limit, $200 or $500 max buy-in game.

I always, 100% of the time play my A+ game with my first buy-in. I ALWAYS build up my first buy-in to a similiar 2-5 times my buy-in.

Then... I start to feel invincible, make to many over-calls, and try to pull of moves that have negative EV.

I can't explain it. Recently... I have been playing with the sole function of doubling up and walking away. If it's a profitable table oh well... if I'm the best player... oh well. I have figured out how I work... and I'm not going to fight against the tide any longer.

Now... sometimes I will go back to the very same table 1/2 an hour later... but once I doulbe my stack... i get up.
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  #4  
Old 11-03-2005, 08:31 PM
I.Rowboat I.Rowboat is offline
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Default Re: At 2.5x the buy-in i turn into a donk....help me figure out why

[ QUOTE ]
3. the time frame is always about the same. i wonder if i just get to a point where i lose some focus and start playing poorly just because i'm tired or bored.

[/ QUOTE ]

I find when I play online, I have difficulty staying focused beyond a couple of hours. Live, I can play for 10-12 hours and still feel competitive, but I find the pace of play online makes this much harder. I see nothing wrong with playing until you begin to lose your edge and then packing it in for a while. Good players stop before they get sloppy and become bad players. And rare is the player that is able to keep focus indefinitely. I say, take a break when you feel your edge slipping. The game will still be there when you get back to it,
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  #5  
Old 11-04-2005, 02:52 PM
wadea wadea is offline
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Default Re: At 2.5x the buy-in i turn into a donk....help me figure out why

I've thought about this before. I kind of think it's mostly the other players playing differently against you once you get more chips. If you are sitting at a NL$100 table with $250, other players probably assume you amassed those chips through stellar play. That might be a generally incorrect assumption (although in your case I'm sure it's true), but I think that's what happens. Thus, they are very wary of you and they may tighten up in pots you enter. Inferior hands that they might have called you down with if you only had $100 behind, they may now fold, while every time they go to showdown against you they have a very strong hand.

It doesn't make any logical sense for them to play this way, but logic has no bearing on many of these players' actions.

-w.a.
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  #6  
Old 11-04-2005, 03:32 PM
varoadstter varoadstter is offline
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Default Re: At 2.5x the buy-in i turn into a donk....help me figure out why

I'm gonna go with choice #1, here. I suspect that even though the money you won and the money you bought in with is the same value, you probably treat the money won differently. Hands that you would fold if you were playing with your buyin are suddenly good enough for you to play since you're up. I'm afraid that I am not immune to this thinking, either.

Another possibility to consider is the impact of big hands when you have a big stack against another big stack. In limit, this doesn't matter but in NL, it's the essense of the game. If you make one big mistake here, you can go broke. Doesn't matter that you spent eight hours building that chip stack - it's gone on one really bad hand (suckout, misread, etc.) to someone who has you covered.

What's cool about the second possibility is that it can work in your favor as well. Many times I spend hours grinding away to get my initial stack to around 2x the buyin and then on one key hand I get doubled up and suddenly you're rolling in it. Such is the way of this game.

In short: leaks, bad - Variance, bitch.
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  #7  
Old 11-07-2005, 08:37 AM
pokerbo pokerbo is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2005
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Default Re: At 2.5x the buy-in i turn into a donk....help me figure out why

This is not an uncommon problem. I too seem to double up my stack and then lose it all. Just last night in a $50 max table, I doubled up after about 20 mins, then lost the lot over the next 40 mins.

I think quitting when your ahead is a good idea if winning affects your game. Lots of players (me included) start to play a different game when they are winning big or losing big.
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