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  #1  
Old 12-27-2005, 04:23 PM
medaugh medaugh is offline
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Default BB special, flops the stupid end; What to do now?

Don't have good reads on anyone involved in the hand. They are pretty typical .25-.50 players. They play some hands good and just play others like donks.... kinda like me [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img].

PokerRoom 0.25/0.50 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is BB with 4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] . CO posts a blind of $0.25.
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, MP2 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, CO (poster) checks, Button calls, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(6 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, have the feeling that I should raise here to try to take it down now.

Whats the plan if we get caller and say like a 9 falls. bet/fold?
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  #2  
Old 12-27-2005, 04:28 PM
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Default Re: BB special, flops the stupid end; What to do now?

I would raise on the flop but you aren't going to get rid of OESDs or many gutters. If you get 3-bet you may want to slow down, but it will two pair or an over pair as often as the big end. Until 4 to the big end of the stright are on the board I'm going to keep raising and then call down and hope someone hit two pair and no one hated money and was just calling with the big straight.
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  #3  
Old 12-27-2005, 04:34 PM
Yerma Yerma is offline
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Default Re: BB special, flops the stupid end; What to do now?

I think if you raise you might get someone to fold a ten. So, I would raise. Also, some people are going to call you drawing near dead anyhow.
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  #4  
Old 12-27-2005, 05:36 PM
RustyCJ RustyCJ is offline
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Default Re: BB special, flops the stupid end; What to do now?

*grunch*

I raise the flop, if you have callers and then get 3-bet, I would probably wait and see what the turn brings, if it's a good card and SB leads out I would raise again.
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  #5  
Old 12-27-2005, 06:55 PM
Black Peter Black Peter is offline
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Default Re: BB special, flops the stupid end; What to do now?

[ QUOTE ]
Don't have good reads on anyone involved in the hand. They are pretty typical .25-.50 players. They play some hands good and just play others like donks.... kinda like me [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img].

PokerRoom 0.25/0.50 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is BB with 4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] . CO posts a blind of $0.25.
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, MP2 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, CO (poster) checks, Button calls, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(6 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, have the feeling that I should raise here to try to take it down now.

Whats the plan if we get caller and say like a 9 falls. bet/fold?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you get a caller and the 9 hits, that means he was calling for the gutshot? Not likely... I'd be more worried if a 10 hit.
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  #6  
Old 12-27-2005, 07:03 PM
sean c sean c is offline
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Default Re: BB special, flops the stupid end; What to do now?

I raise the flop and face everyone with 4:1. SB could also be value betting his OESD and check the turn. If you just call now someone in late position may raise their draw or made hand and SB may not bet again. Your given the chance to face the field with two cold and pretty weak odds so do it you may not get the chance later.
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  #7  
Old 12-27-2005, 07:18 PM
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Default Re: BB special, flops the stupid end; What to do now?

I raise the flop. You want to force out a 9 or a 5 by facing them with 2 cold (probably not gonna happen but you'll win bigger pots for the times when they don't hit), and every time this happens there's usually someone calling down with AQ or something like that (or they might put you on that). Holla big blind,

BBB
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  #8  
Old 12-27-2005, 08:38 PM
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Default Re: BB special, flops the stupid end; What to do now?

About 30 percent of the time you'll see a 9 or a 10 fall. Let's take 3 scenarios:
Scenario 1: Someone has 9T-
Welcome to Screwedville, population you. I think it's foolish to ever get away from this hand being afraid of that. The light would start flickering after some major fireworks, at which point the pot is so large I'd call it down.
Scenario 2: You're facing a 9 and a T, but not in the same hand-
One of them will hit 23% of the time by the river. "They, collectively, have 6 outs. Maybe you're getting rid of the guy holding the T, not the 9.
Scenario 3: You're facing a 9 or a T, not both.
He will hit the high end 18% of the time. The 9 is still going nowhere, T probably won't either.

So worst cases you're losing this hand 20% of the time if these situations exist. I'm guessing they do at least half the time. Meaning you lose 10% of the time, 15% if they exist 3/4 of the time. Let as many bets roll in as possible. Call I say. If it gets narrowed down with SB's bet start raising and get more bets out of the fewer players.

Hmm, I guess those numbers don't matter since those are the hands NOT going away. Nice when the analysis proves it's usesless. All the more reasons to let the most marginal hands have a reason to stay. Get the others hooked on this hand. Then get those overpairs, pair the SB may have, and draws calling raises on the turn/river. Maybe those UI overs will improve to a hand that all of a sudden wants to re raise you, i.e. AK and an A hits. Better yet QQ and a Q hits.

And if the board pairs, fold- you are DEFINTELY against quads.
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  #9  
Old 12-27-2005, 10:57 PM
masse75 masse75 is offline
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Default Re: BB special, flops the stupid end; What to do now?

[ QUOTE ]
I raise the flop. You want to force out a 9 or a 5 by facing them with 2 cold (probably not gonna happen but you'll win bigger pots for the times when they don't hit), and every time this happens there's usually someone calling down with AQ or something like that (or they might put you on that). Holla big blind,

BBB

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this is one of those cases where a raise still doesn't protect you against an OESD. If you raise now, pot is at 8SB, and they're getting 4:1 if they cold-call 2 bets (that's assuming no other callers--so implied odds are much better). Assuming everyone flat calls, pot is at 6 BB's on the turn. If SB leads again, raise there...now it's 9:2, or 4.5:1 to call with just the river to come. Technically, they don't have odds to call (odds of hitting the 8-outer is 4.75:1), but I think implied odds will still keep them in it. They're probably not calculating that, but they'd be correct to donk along.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
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  #10  
Old 12-27-2005, 11:02 PM
masse75 masse75 is offline
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Default Re: BB special, flops the stupid end; What to do now?

[ QUOTE ]
And if the board pairs, fold- you are DEFINTELY against quads.

[/ QUOTE ]

????????
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