Aces play a big pot? Prima 25-50NL

[neon]

Prima 25-50 NL. Full ring.

Two limpers to me in LP, I raise to $300 w/ A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. CO calls, button calls, blinds fold, first limper folds, MP (second limper) calls.

LP is a very solid, winning regular in this game. He has me way covered. Button seems a bit clever, probably about average for this game. MP is an unknown. I have both button and MP covered, but not by a ton. In about the orbit and a half since I sat down, the deck has hit me in the face and I have probably raised four times already and won each pot uncontested w/ a bet on the flop. I have not yet gone to showdown. I have ~$5,000.

(~$1,350) Flop is 4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. Check, I bet $1k, CO folds, button calls, MP folds.

(~$3,350) Turn is the A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].

I have ~$3,700 left, villain ~$3,000.

What's your move?

Thanks in advance.

-neon

[Prevaricator]

I think you just have to push. A set won't fold, a club might check behind if you check, and I dont see you folding if you check and he goes allin, so you have to pay the flush off.

[freemoney]

you cant fold here so i think its a matter of getting your money in showing the least strength. i think most hands that you beat minus a set check behind you and i dont wanna give a free card here, the only thing you really can do because the size of the pot is push.

[TO1]

it really comes down to how aggressive your opponent is. you said hes clever, but would he play a scare card on the turn? if so id rather check/call and give a chance for him to try to take the pot away with a hand like 99-JJ if he believes you are about QQ or KK. if he does happen to have a set he will bet the turn reguardless. so its almost always better to check/call. if he happens to check behind and a club falls, i probably move allin on the river, trying to push a T high or so club off

[xorbie]

I would definetely overbet this pot on the flop. Make it look like AK trying to steal, especially if you have already taken down four pots in just one orbit. Bet like $1,500 on the flop and hope to get raised.

On the turn, why push? Any flush is calling, and any lower set or flop overpair is folding. Let him do the pushing, and hope he has a set, not the flush (it's unlikely he has you read for AK[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and only that, so I think his smooth call makes sense on the flop with a set or flush draw, but not so much with an overpair).

[Prevaricator]

how is a lower set folding?

[LuvDemNutz]

[ QUOTE ]
I would definetely overbet this pot on the flop. Make it look like AK trying to steal, especially if you have already taken down four pots in just one orbit. Bet like $1,500 on the flop and hope to get raised.

On the turn, why push? Any flush is calling, and any lower set or flop overpair is folding. Let him do the pushing, and hope he has a set, not the flush (it's unlikely he has you read for AK[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and only that, so I think his smooth call makes sense on the flop with a set or flush draw, but not so much with an overpair).

[/ QUOTE ]

If you're Villain you're folding a set here? Does pushing telegraph Hero's hand that much? Wouldn't some aggressive players push with KcKx or AxKc?

[LuvDemNutz]

Riddle me this:

1) If you're Villain and have a lower set - do you bet this turn if checked to?

2) If you check and a club falls on the river (not the 4c) what would you do?

[TO1]

[ QUOTE ]
Riddle me this:

1) If you're Villain and have a lower set - do you bet this turn if checked to?

2) If you check and a club falls on the river (not the 4c) what would you do?

[/ QUOTE ]

first off i almost always raise the flop with a set here, but if i did flat call then i about half pot on the turn. if its checked behind on turn and club falls i move in, villain either had 99-JJ, a small flush he made on turn that he played poorly or an underpair to the board so there's certainly player of fold equity if this unlikely situation comes up. its also unlikely that opponent has a hand like KcJc or KcQc since most good players wont play these big cards for a raise.

[xorbie]

Now that I think about it, no, probably not. Still, villain does fold a passively played JJ/QQ, so I'd still recommend check/calling.