betgo's red zone idea in practice - Page 2

Exitonly · #11 10-25-2005, 02:26 AM

AGAIN!

0evg0 · #12 10-25-2005, 02:27 AM

I need to re-read the thread maybe. I don't know. I haven't slept in too long. I think if I highlight the bottom of betgo's original post it will show "haha. you're a dumbass." in white caps.

good night.

edit: "this is very similar to the gigabet stack size thread from a while ago"

Obviously I'm not the only one seeing the similarities. Is betgo trying to gauge his respect by copying Giga's theory and evaluating the response?

I'm going to have fun reading this tomorrow.

pfkaok · #13 10-25-2005, 02:29 AM

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AGAIN!

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HAHAHA. yep. 3 of my 5 tables are bubble or later, so i'm even less looking at my preview posts.

adanthar · #14 10-25-2005, 03:39 AM

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Obviously I'm not the only one seeing the similarities.

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4 BB != 20 BB <font color="white">Gigabet had 4 or 5 BB in that hand, which is like 95% of the difference </font>

but apparently 4 BB is better, so what do I know

pfkaok · #15 10-25-2005, 03:58 AM

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4 BB != 20 BB Gigabet had 4 or 5 BB in that hand, which is like 95% of the difference

but apparently 4 BB is better, so what do I know

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i guess you mean the pushers stack in gigs thread to the one in mine, but thats not really the point...this hand is quite similar in terms of mine and Gigabets stack sizes. they're both at a point where its beneficial to GAMBLE, so long as the gamble is at least very close to breakeven or better. sure the situations are different, and the hands played out a lot diferently, but i'm pretty sure its the same, or at least a very similar concept.

Vee Quiva · #16 10-25-2005, 03:54 PM

This is a horrible play. There's no way you're 40% here. You are praying he turns over unpaired over cards or Ace-X.

I just don't understand why you would risk your tournament life here. Going from 20-40 BB does not increase your tournament equity all that much at this point in the tournament.

Now if you were down to 10-12 BB this might make a little more sense. Still I will always hate calling with 10 high.

#17 10-25-2005, 04:15 PM

You do realize that by going into the redzone here, even though more EV+ spots may open up than if you had a mid-ranged stack, you are merely trying to recover the chips you just lost on a -EV / MAYBE 0EV spot, without even being able to do so by doubling up? You also realize, that with your current stack, and the blinds continually going up, if you do not come across any +EV spots to bring your stack up, eventually you will enter the red-zone anyway and those same red-zone spots will become available, except for more chips?

I suggest doing your best to pick +EV spots throughout, and not finding excuses to get your money in with the worst of it. If you get into the redzone due to a +EV play you made, so be it, let the cards come as they may. Don't pick -EV spots on this kind of basis, though.

Exitonly · #18 10-25-2005, 04:21 PM

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I suggest doing your best to pick +EV spots throughout, and not finding excuses to get your money in with the worst of it. If you get into the redzone due to a +EV play you made, so be it, let the cards come as they may. Don't pick -EV spots on this kind of basis, though.

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well said. it's not the end of the world to have a short stack, but i'm not going to make any marginally losing plays to chance getting there. and i really dont think theres much of an argument to do so.

--

In that AJs hand, that's a +EV push, and that same +EV situation you're talking about after the blinds pass you, will still be there, and this time you'll have more chips, and you'll be building your stack back up. Theres no way i'm passing up +EV w/ a stack of 10BB, just so i could MAYBE (who says it gets folded to me, or that i get any good cards) get a MARGINALLY more +EV situation, just so i can get back to where i just was??! That really doesn't make any sense.

betgo · #19 10-25-2005, 04:42 PM

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This is a horrible play. There's no way you're 40% here. You are praying he turns over unpaired over cards or Ace-X.

I just don't understand why you would risk your tournament life here. Going from 20-40 BB does not increase your tournament equity all that much at this point in the tournament.

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I like the call because you are atleast 40%. This is a resteal situation. You are a 7-2 dog versus an overpair, 3-2 versus AK/AQ, and 2-1 if someone has a T or 9. However, you are about even versus Ax or 22-88, and a 5-3 favorite versus a lower suited connector. There is no reason to believe villain has a big hand.

You are mainly gambling to make a big stack and win the tournament. If you lose and wind up in the red zone, you can play aggressively and you still have a shot.

pfkaok · #20 10-25-2005, 05:11 PM

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You are mainly gambling to make a big stack and win the tournament. If you lose and wind up in the red zone, you can play aggressively and you still have a shot.

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yes. why is it that it seems like everyone else on here refuses to even think this way. i mean, is it so hard to believe that taking highrisk GAMBLING plays is correct at times?

and yes. in this spot i'm pretty sure i'm at least very close to 40%. he's an aggressive player, and very likely knows that i'm an aggressive player in steal position. his range here is quite large.